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Re: Wife objecting to paying school fees for nephew

by millymoo » Fri May 30, 2014 8:44 pm

Agree with much of what has been said hear re singling out one particular relative over others and I think you need to ask yourself if you do go ahead with this how you will feel if this nephew doesn't measure up to your idea of success (whatever that may be, financially or professionally). I'm not sure of the make up of your own family but as a mum working full time in financial services with two daughters I feel very strongly about girls having the same access to education and opportunities as their male counterparts so you may want to consider what kind of effect something like this would have on any siblings that your nephew has. A lot of interesting debate hear and hope you reach right conclusion for everyone involved.

Re: Wife objecting to paying school fees for nephew

by MotherSisWife » Wed May 14, 2014 12:00 pm

I wish you were my uncle, lol.
Coming from a council flat myself and still living in council accommodation, no one wants to stay there. So if you are able to help then by all means do so. With the financial help you provide him he will go on to help others. Thus creating a butterfly effect.

Why have just one really successful person in a family when you can have many...

Re: Wife objecting to paying school fees for nephew

by Cityhubby » Mon May 12, 2014 1:55 pm

Thank you again to everyone who has responded.

The question as to whether it was the school or myself that was responsible for my current job is an interesting one.

Obviously I've had to do a relatively good job but I honestly meant it when I wrote that I found myself working in a bank. They were different times and all one had to do was turn up with a good degree from a good university and they'd start you with a thousand others.

I don't have time to respond to every reply but I am reading avidly.

Thank you again

Re: Wife objecting to paying school fees for nephew

by twice_as_nice » Mon May 12, 2014 1:50 pm

Wow this is really interesting! You're very generous for thinking of this, and obviously because of the opportunity you were given, but my tuppences worth are:

a) what will the impact on their broader family be?
how many bright nieces and nephews do you have? if you apply the 'brightness' rule to all, would you then need to think about putting more children through this? Would the less bright nephews and nieces actually not benefit more from a private education than their brighter brother / cousins? Will your other nieces and nephews not feel that they are less valued/ less bright than the others. You were obviously very emotionally mature to be able to understand the conversation you had with your dad - do you think your nephew is? and do you think the others are emotionally mature enough to understand?

b) a state eduction - even in a school with a poor reputation - doesn't mean a poor eduction or poor outcome for that individual.
We all are a product of our experience and most of us stick with what we know and prefer because thats what we are comfortable with. I went to a state school, not a great one, not a grammar, not a really bad one. Just normal. I did pretty well, and I completely believe that my success at work was due to the broader education I had - e.g. the EQ you get from interacting with a broader range of people. I don't doubt you get better contacts from private schools but I do think the broad privilege that most people live in at private schools (of course not all - and in your case I can see you were different) gives a different attitude to those who come from a state background. You were probably lucky because you had both grounding and good schooling, and you appreciated that.

c) I'd also venture to suggest that your success is undoubtedly in part due to your schooling but also in a big part due to the family support you had and your general approach and personality. So don't think that because this boy doesn't have the educational opportunities, he can't be as successful as you.

Perhaps the best thing you can do for him is to provide additional tutoring to help supplement the teaching as others have suggested? This will help him but not alienate him from his other siblings - and you could probably afford to do this for all the children so its fair for all?

Re: Wife objecting to paying school fees for nephew

by supergirl » Mon May 12, 2014 11:05 am

Well done! This is very generous and kind but in my opinion there are other ways to help and making a difference than singling one out.

How does one measure brightness? Grades only, IQ tests? It has been proven many times that intelligence is difficult because it covers so many. If academically one finds it hard does mske you unintelligent? Not fit for uni?

I discovered 18months ago i was dyslexic. My all life and experience would have been different if i had known before (i am 37 now). My older was deemed the most successfull. Well i ve done pretty well despite the odds being against me!!!!

Would you choose one of your child and do what your father did at the expense of the others? If the answer is no then dont do it.

But please help all your nieces and nephews you never know what the future hold. Help with advices, mentoring, tutiring, school applications, bursary, set uo ISAs for them or trust funds, etc. but dont decide that you ll help just one kid please.

That would be my reservation if i was your wife. That and you proving to me that our children education is paid for. Ie. you could negotiate 25% disc on your children fees if you pay upfront 5yrs. Then having a trust for secondary school money and uni. I would absolutely dont care about skiing holidays but yes would expect at least 1 family holidays a year (nothing fancy though).

Talk to you wife. Good luck and keep being a generous human being.

Re: Wife objecting to paying school fees for nephew

by Scientist » Mon May 12, 2014 10:59 am

My tuppence worth - with apologies if someone else has made the same points already:

Why not consider preparing him for a good grammar school, if there is one within striking distance ? Some of the smart money says that the best state education is now a clever choice for children, who are more likely to be well favoured when it comes to university and possibly even jobs.

I am the product of a very expensive education as are my siblings. As a family, we have probably ended up with more social advantage than anything else and if that is what you seek, it is still available in the upper echelons of the independent sector. But if you look at the outstanding education offered by many grammar schools, it is as good as independent (don't be fooled, cheap independent education is like cheap Champagne - a waste of money). I took my children out of the independent sector and they are at a very good state school.

You could perhaps look at some private tutoring etc as an initial outlay.

Re: Wife objecting to paying school fees for nephew

by windowboxes » Mon May 12, 2014 9:36 am

Good morning,

First, what a lovely gesture and fortunate position you are in to offer an additional family member.
I can relate in term of helping out additional family member with cars, home loans, and holidays, and they were all appreciated my help.
I would like to highlight there has never been a scenario, he got more then she did, and I think if your family are incline to react this way you wouldn't be offering such an opportunity.

2, is the school the right fit for your nephew? Academically? Culture? Value? Personality? They should all be considered.

3, how does your sister/brother feel about this?

4, if you decide to go ahead if only for 3-5 years, your nephew will benefit from the experience, and exposure. However I would suggest a chat similar to your fathers. Certain grades need to be maintained, responsibility taken, without him feeling too much pressure.

5, your wife clearly has reservations, (I do hope they are not selfish reasons i.e. missing a skiing holiday, or cruise trip) these must be heard.
If you have a solution and answers to her worries I see no reason why you cannot offer your nephew a life changing opportunity.

You hear family members stating they would do anything for each other; this is how you and your wife can help, what a humble feeling this must be

Re: Wife objecting to paying school fees for nephew

by cynic » Mon May 12, 2014 9:08 am

City hubby, writing as a man with similar escaping his background issues I would offer a few thoughts:
Overall I think you may benefit from going to have a chat about all this with someone as there's likely a lot of issues for you. You may not be the kind of person who does therapy, but there are some very sensible helpful ones out there.

Please forgive me if I outline some questions about all this, in no way meant to intrude or offend in any way.
Was it appropriate for you, as just a child, to be offered this very adult 'contract' of you get 'opportunity' now but you will financially support the family later? That's quite a responsibility for a child. How did you feel about that?
Did you ask for your special treatment? I imagine you may say that you just turned out to be lot brighter than your siblings, or perhaps that you were 'lucky' but I imagine along the way you also worked pretty hard with this natural talent? Do you feel this is acknowledged?
Also you say you 'now do pretty well', it would perhaps be too simple to suggest you feel a bit 'guilty' about that at times, but perhaps actually you don't feel guilty at all? Perhaps others even unintentionally would like you to feel this.
We owe our parents a great debt, you are in a position where you can make big and real contributions to them or by proxy to them, to your siblings, but is this a way of paying that debt?
This new suggestion of paying for the education of one nephew does that mean all your other generous contributions will have to stop? So actually is this new suggestion a way to consolidate/simplify things?
Perhaps maybe would like these contributions to stop, but only by making this new huge financial undertaking, do you feel you can do/say that?

If the word debt feels appropriate, at what stage might you consider this debt paid?

If any of these thoughts chime in any way, I would really recommend you speak with someone, you may find it very rewarding.

Re: Wife objecting to paying school fees for nephew

by ZannaW » Mon May 12, 2014 8:44 am

Clearly this is a very generous opportunity to even consider offering your nephew and initially I thought it was sad that your wife did not share this generousity and was concerned that it was possibly not fair on your own children and on her side of the family.

However, her response reflects the different feelings of people in general and the outcome of this could end up not being entirely positive. If it was me, and it is not as I am not in this position, I think I would try to use my good fortune in a less specific way less centred on one child as it was on you so that singling out becomes a burden on him a second time around. Others have suggested tutoring, support moving house or help applying to scholarships. These are all excellent ideas. You will also be in a position to help your nephew later down the line with mentoring, internships etc.

You could also think about starting a scholarship fund amongst your peers or other alumni for which your nephew and other less fortunate children could apply. When I was younger, my Dad was a trustee for an established fund that had several different philanthropic interests. One was to give scholarships to students from developing countries to come and study at Oxford. When I was 16 I went to a drinks reception with my parents to meet the students. I didn't fully understand at the time but one of the students openly explained to me what his life would have been like without the scholarship.

I am not saying that he wouldn't appreciate it, but your focused attention on your nephew could be a poisoned chailice for him should he not react as well as you to the limelight. How would you feel at the end of it if he wanted to go to art college and spend his life working in cafés to keep himself afloat as an artist paying rent on a studio? I know a few public school alumni in this position.

I wish you the very best in making this decision and I hope something great comes from it.

Re: Wife objecting to paying school fees for nephew

by nuttymummy » Fri May 09, 2014 11:13 pm

You sound like an awesome brother/uncle!
We have also found ourselves in a situation of having to help out my husband's siblings/their children in various situations, though sadly not for such good reasons as you are helping yours out (other than 'they're family - it's what you do'). What changed the ball game for me however was having children of our own (sadly we are prob not same financial 'league' as you but it's all relative!)....to cover all bases my criteria to my husband on this would be 1. Have we paid off our mortgage & if so are we happy to not trade up in value at any point (perfectly possible if you plan to leave Central London & move to an area less 'expensive') 2. If educating privately do we have the funds for our own children's full school fees in the bank? 3. If providing this opportunity it has to be followed through to the end (for the sake of the child in question - it is not fair to offer this & then say 'oops, I lost my job...') so it should be funded up front...actually most schools offer a major discount for paying say 5 years fees in advance so should you go ahead do look into it!
I think other posters suggestions re looking into tutoring, better alternative local schools, grammar schools?!, independent day schools which don't cost the earth, finding out re scholarship options are your best place to start.
I also think Goldhawk's point is excellent - you have managed to avoid ill feeling from your siblings thus far but if you single out one of their children this could change the scenario irrevocably....
Good luck and I really hope you find some common ground!!

Re: Wife objecting to paying school fees for nephew

by Vhopeful » Fri May 09, 2014 7:46 pm

Perhaps you could help them move house to the best state school in the area so that any other siblings would also benefit....

Re: Wife objecting to paying school fees for nephew

by Cityhubby » Fri May 09, 2014 6:58 pm

Goldhawk
It's an excellent point.

I am aware that I am "selecting" a child for special treatment and then I worry do I need to have the same conversation with him as my Dad had with me?

Am I setting a precedent where the brightest will be bought/brought down to London leaving the others behind.

Not easy...

Re: Wife objecting to paying school fees for nephew

by Goldhawk » Fri May 09, 2014 6:30 pm

What about the other nephews/nieces?

Whilst you don't think it caused resentment with your siblings perhaps it did

You clearly felt guilty enough about it to pay out for lots of stuff for your family

Re: Wife objecting to paying school fees for nephew

by Mrs Contractor Mum » Fri May 09, 2014 6:25 pm

I think if you can't guarantee you can afford it all the way through then your best bet is to support with tutoring for exams and applications for scholarships but set realistic expectations.

The other option as I can see is if you can assist your sister if she is willing to move to be in a non crappy school vicinity which will not only benefit your nephew but any other children your sister has.

I think it's great you want to support your nephew and I wish you all the luck with it.

Re: Wife objecting to paying school fees for nephew

by Writerlady » Fri May 09, 2014 5:58 pm

I think it's a wonderful, kind and thoughtful thing to do and i would be totally behind my husband if he wanted to do this. It's so nice to recognise what your sibling/s did for you and grasp an opportunity to help your brother's family in this way. You earn, let's face it, a LOT of money. There are so many 'me me me' people around these days. It's amazing to read of your plans, and your reasons. It brings tears to my eyes. I think it is absolutely the right thing to do.

I do think Mrs Contractor Mum's and Beketaten's suggestions are also excellent though too. Sort of a middle ground, and Beketaten makes very valid points.

From reading your post, you feel very strongly about this. Also reading about what your father said to you. You feel a responsibility. A couple of generations ago the wealthier/luckier members of a family would always help out the less fortunate because they are just that . . . Family. It seems to be every man for himself these days. Your wife wants to 'balance things out' by asking who on her side you will give handouts to. It's not about that.

Absolutely right you should treat your nephew's fees in the same way as you treat your own children's. And yes, that could impact on your own children in some way. That's a risk you take. They'll survive.

If i was your wife i'd love you even more for even thinking of doing something like this, rather than wanting to blow it on a couple of sports cars or another handful of ski-ing holidays.

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