Ah....the problems we face in this shamefully elitist country of ours!
& very topical in the light of this recent government report...shocking.

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/. ... _Final.pdf

chatty mama wrote: Don't get too hung up on your son 'losing out' by going to state school. All my uni housemates went to 'ok' state schools and have done exceptionally well (I mean EXCEPTIONALLY) well in their careers. While private schools are, on the whole, excellent, don't underestimate the value of a loving, supportive home (where education is highly valued), where as a child you're brought up to work hard and believe you can achieve anything. It's THIS that got all my housemates so far (all their parents are awesome).

well said.

rugby

Some posts on this site are merely a specific question and some are of a nature that invites more open-ended replies. I didn't realise it was in your gift to decide which is which, I thought the point was to allow, perhaps even encourage, discussion?
(I would guess the clue *might* be in the word forum)

Several posters appear to be advocating that a private school bursary is not really any business of anyone's or that of the OP. I was merely trying to offer some (IMHO useful) background to that suggestion, admittedly by introducing those pesky little things called 'facts'.

If these facts are not to your liking I can only apologise, but repeatedly calling them "claptrap" won't change them or that.
You can only change them by challenging those facts with other, perhaps better facts, that's how it all works, you see.
And yet it is you who scolds me for bad 'etiquette'. Wow.

Apologies to all for banging-on, here's an article in that left-wing rag, The Telegraph
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/education/ed ... upils.html

"Political claptrap" aside, fraud is a criminal offence. It looks as though your friend has obtained a pecuniary advantage (the bursary) by fraud (lying about the house deposit, and possibly also about other things). People should not be allowed to get away with that sort of crime, particularly in circumstances where they may have deprived a more deserving family of much-needed financial assistance. If you no longer value the friendship (which would be understandable) and are ok with being a "snitch", it sounds like the right thing to do.

Cynic

I decline to deviate the OP from their polite question, it is very bad forum etiquette.

If you wish to start a new thread on such claptrap I do not promise to engage as your views are clearly unreasonable and mine are obviously different. This is also not a particularly good venue for such a national discussion.

MatSnow wrote:I attended perhaps the very best private school in Britain, Westminster...

Nice one - this is one of the most (presumably unintentionally) hilarious posts I've read on here in a while...!

Confused Mom,

Your son is going to remain on the path he is on regardless of whether you report the other kid's parents or not. "I know it's not the end of the world... hundreds of people leave my son's school-to-be happy..." is revealing, because it implies that the actual issue is that you would prefer to be sending him to the school that your friends have "cheated" their way into, and that that is the source of your discomfort.

I'd be under no illusion that if you did report your friend, whether directly or by cryptically telling the school that you knew that someone had falsified bursary information she'd end up knowing it was you. I doubt she's volunteered info of the detail she's revealed to you to anyone else. Costing someone's child their place in a school the parents really wanted could provoke a pretty extreme reaction. Also, how would you feel if they ended up being prosecuted for fraud (not likely, but possible)?

rugby,

I would agree my second post has political elements, that's why I separated it from my first reply to the OP.
It was largely addressed to the posters who thought no harm had really been done or that bursaries don't really matter to the rest of us.

Should you actually care to challenge me on any of facts I've stated in that second post (I think I'm largely happy with them) then groovy, let's investigate those.

If you just wanna label it "claptrap" then you're not really adding much.

Cynic

That is a ridiculous bunch of political claptrap.

It also has nothing to do with the OP

While it is accepted by all that everyone/anyone has the right to pay twice for their children's education, should they choose to do so, I personally think the administration of bursaries is a matter that ought to concern us all.

Nearly all private schools have charitable status which means they have some very significant tax breaks; some of which accumulate over time, even though many of they are pretty commercial operations (7% increase in fees this year anyone?).
As such we ALL, in-effect, subsidise private schools through our taxes.

Many reasonable people agree that the very minimum a private school ought to be obliged to do (to partially acknowledge their massive tax breaks) is to offer some free or heavily-subsidised places to some pupils who wouldn't ordinarily get to attend them.
I would note that:
(i) where you are on the political spectrum only seems to influence what proportion you think they should offer,
(ii) this proportion is currently shy of any level that would effect the long-term profitability of their operations so it's an straightforward deduction to point out the cost of these bursaries is less than the cost of their (accumulated) tax break.

Ergo we all, in-effect, pay these bursaries!

Firstly any suggestion that the parents of this child will forgo income in any real sense, (other than perhaps in the time window needed to jump through this bursary hoop) is quite frankly laughable!

The important question is, who is losing out here?

- the school?
Well some will argue that the bursary is gonna get paid out anyway.
From what the OP has told us of the process, the school has asked for some documentation about parental financial status.
Do you think the school is going through the motions of this audit (write me a letter saying you did something vs. show me a bank statement?) and simply paying lip service to the importance and the role of bursaries or do you think the ethos of school and trustees in this regard is actually v.strong and they are desperately trying to do an thorough audit to find the most deserving cases.


- the kid who didn't get the bursary?
Are you able to find out what backgrounds of children who've gotten bursaries in the recent past? Why not talk to the school as someone interested in their bursary process and ethos? (Or pose as a very wealthy would-be parent).

Putting it bluntly, if next-in-the-queue for that bursary was likely to be just another relatively-middle class kid whose parents can't quite afford the fees at the moment cos of various choices/even unfortunate events, but without it that kid will essentially be fine i.e. perhaps someone like YOUR SON (no offence) then I would probably concern yourself no more with this; as Omar in The Wire would say "it's all in the game".
IF however this bursary may very well have gone to a kid for who it may have proved life-changing, well then, I refer you to Mr Burke:
"All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good (people) do nothing."

(Though I agree with one poster that you don't need to drop your friends in it, you could just alert the school, how they respond will tell you a lot)

You are just envious.
Whether they did a fraud or not, it will not change where your son goes to school.
So then why waste your time wallowing in envy??!!
Instead you should focus on your son and his education. We all know many examples of people who went to state schools and are doing exceptionally well, and also many example of people who went to very good private schools and are not doing that well...

I guess I would understand your outrage more if your son was actually going to attend the private school and therefore you were having to pay the full fee but your friends didn't have to.

But as you're not going to that school anyway I don't really understand the outrage. How one family wants to conduct their finances is up to them I guess.

My husband had a very wealthy friend at school who was on a full means tested scholarship, so obviously some form fiddling went on there! He was ridiculed at school for it (and it came up in the best man's speech at his wedding I think!) but I don't think anyone actually bore a grudge about it.

Confusedmom

You aren't confused at all - your Moral Compass has good sense.

Your friends have artificially adjusted their income to obtain a bursary and no doubt made a statement as to need for the money - WRONG

Those who say it would be socially unnacceptable to spread rumours or try and report this are right - BUT this doesn't make the act right

Those who say you have in some way got it wrong need to have their moral compasses adjusted. In 21st Century Britain it is hard to stay on the right track, so many are being led into bad thought processes.

Have confidence in your moral compass - it's a good one!

I'm sorry but I think this sounds like jealousy.