by greengrass » Wed Dec 11, 2019 8:23 pm
I have avoided talking on this thread, but I feel there are several points raised here I need to speak my piece on, particularly if you're coming at this from an anti-Brexit (just had to edit this from anti-EU, whoops!) point of view. Apologies, this is a little long.
1. Jeremy Corbyn’s stance on Brexit. He has been vociferously anti-EU almost his entire political life. From a voting record point of view, he's probably more anti-EU than Jacob Rees Mogg. His sudden and very recent pro-EU epiphany smacks of an opportunistic and cynical power grab as he knows the Remain contingent is very strong within his party.
2. As others have pointed out here, and following on from point 1, Labour in general is very ambiguous on its position regards Brexit, even now. This is apparently a deliberate strategy, to appeal to all sides. It may even work, as a good-sized part (though certainly not all) of the Labour vote is tribal, and will vote for the party regardless of their Brexit stance. Evidence of very deep untrustworthiness, and it is extremely unclear which way they will land regards Brexit if they gain power.
3. Hung Parliament scenario. Jo Swinson has categorically ruled out any potential coalition with Labour in the event of this happening. Considering how badly the Lib Dems have fared recently when it comes to coalitions, I do not believe she is bluffing. Labour may not need them though, which raises the question, who will they form a coalition with? The SNP? Their price will be very high indeed, and that’s assuming they and Labour can agree on anything which is very far from certain.
4. 2nd referendum. People didn't know what they were voting for. Do they know now? What if they vote the wrong way? Again? And if the first one was only advisory, doesn't that make the second one advisory as well? In which case, what's the point of having it?
5. The economy. Most Remainers are appalled by Brexit, as it represents in their view an inevitable economic disaster. So it is rather odd that some of them would be prepared to vote, tactically of course, for a party which most of us can agree is populated by Marxists at the very highest level. If anyone really thinks that our economy is safe in the hands of people who openly say they want to destroy capitalism, well, good luck with that one.
6. Tolerance/inclusion. Hooh, boy, where do we start? Another criticism of Brexit was that it was born out of small minded intolerance. So if you’re someone who is disgusted by bigotry in all its forms, I find it peculiar that the current incarnation of Labour is something you would vote for. Since being founded, the Equality and Human Rights Commission to date has investigated only two political parties for institutional racism. One was the BNP. The other is Labour, for whom an investigation into anti-Semitism is ongoing, though evidence unearthed so far is pretty stomach churning. Someone here also mentioned the need to vote Labour in Kensington. I encourage you to look up what the Rt Hon Emma Dent-Coad had to say once about Shaun Bailey. Good old garden variety racism, for which she was only asked to apologise for by the leadership (the whip was not withdrawn).
The New Statesman, to their credit, has been calling Labour out for this for some time, and has withdrawn their support for the Labour party for the first time in its history. Examine that fact if you will, and while you’re at it, examine your consciences. Deeply.
[size=100][font=Calibri,sans-serif]I have avoided talking on this thread, but I feel there are several points raised here I need to speak my piece on, particularly if you're coming at this from an anti-Brexit (just had to edit this from anti-EU, whoops!) point of view. Apologies, this is a little long.
1. Jeremy Corbyn’s stance on Brexit. He has been vociferously anti-EU almost his entire political life. From a voting record point of view, he's probably more anti-EU than Jacob Rees Mogg. His sudden and very recent pro-EU epiphany smacks of an opportunistic and cynical power grab as he knows the Remain contingent is very strong within his party.
2. As others have pointed out here, and following on from point 1, Labour in general is very ambiguous on its position regards Brexit, even now. This is apparently a deliberate strategy, to appeal to all sides. It may even work, as a good-sized part (though certainly not all) of the Labour vote is tribal, and will vote for the party regardless of their Brexit stance. Evidence of very deep untrustworthiness, and it is extremely unclear which way they will land regards Brexit if they gain power.
3. Hung Parliament scenario. Jo Swinson has categorically ruled out any potential coalition with Labour in the event of this happening. Considering how badly the Lib Dems have fared recently when it comes to coalitions, I do not believe she is bluffing. Labour may not need them though, which raises the question, who will they form a coalition with? The SNP? Their price will be very high indeed, and that’s assuming they and Labour can agree on anything which is very far from certain.
4. 2nd referendum. People didn't know what they were voting for. Do they know now? What if they vote the wrong way? Again? And if the first one was only advisory, doesn't that make the second one advisory as well? In which case, what's the point of having it?
5. The economy. Most Remainers are appalled by Brexit, as it represents in their view an inevitable economic disaster. So it is rather odd that some of them would be prepared to vote, tactically of course, for a party which most of us can agree is populated by Marxists at the very highest level. If anyone really thinks that our economy is safe in the hands of people who openly say they want to destroy capitalism, well, good luck with that one.[/font][/size]
[size=100][font=Calibri,sans-serif]6. Tolerance/inclusion. Hooh, boy, where do we start? Another criticism of Brexit was that it was born out of small minded intolerance. So if you’re someone who is disgusted by bigotry in all its forms, I find it peculiar that the current incarnation of Labour is something you would vote for. Since being founded, the Equality and Human Rights Commission to date has investigated only two political parties for institutional racism. One was the BNP. The other is Labour, for whom an investigation into anti-Semitism is ongoing, though evidence unearthed so far is pretty stomach churning. [/font][/size][size=100][font=Calibri,sans-serif]Someone here also mentioned the need to vote Labour in Kensington. I encourage you to look up what the Rt Hon Emma Dent-Coad had to say once about Shaun Bailey. Good old garden variety racism, for which she was only asked to apologise for by the leadership (the whip was not withdrawn).[/font][/size]
[size=100][font=Calibri,sans-serif]The New Statesman, to their credit, has been calling Labour out for this for some time, and has withdrawn their support for the Labour party for the first time in its history. Examine that fact if you will, and while you’re at it, examine your consciences. Deeply.[/font][/size]
