Jane Ellison Article 50

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papinian
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Re: Jane Ellison Article 50

Postby papinian » Tue Jan 31, 2017 5:46 pm

misty32 wrote:papinian, I dont agree with your caustic attitude towards Jane (and other people you have possibly now managed to offend reading this thread), but I do agree that her political life in Battersea has to come to an end.
You described Jane Ellison as "validating our cosying up to Trump whilst disregarding our European neighbours." which is hyperbolic in the extreme and far more caustic than anything I have said on this thread.

The "culture of offence" which you exhibit was one of the factors that contributed to the referendum result. Think about that.
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storm35
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Re: Jane Ellison Article 50

Postby storm35 » Tue Jan 31, 2017 5:57 pm

I am not going to get into a fight but I think that my statement of Jane validating Theresa May's embarrassing trip to the US last week is apples and pears to your personal character assassination of the way she has conducted her life and calling her one of life's followers because she doesnt have children. It suggests you consider everyone who doesnt have children spineless and that she has a flaw because she chose to spend her career at one company. There is nothing wrong with that. I did too in fact.
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denshort
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Re: Jane Ellison Article 50

Postby denshort » Tue Jan 31, 2017 6:06 pm

papinian wrote:misty32, if you wanted an intelligent independent-minded MP then you weren't going to get one in Jane Ellison. She's a perfectly nice woman but 23 years working in John Lewis and not having a family of her own leaves her one of life's followers.

At least Allin-Khan realises what it's like to be a parent. I for one am not comfortable with a childless Prime Minister and childless Secretary of State for Education deciding education policy. There are currently as many gay ministers in the Department for Education as there are ministers who have children of their own.
Because not having a family and being childless makes us not worthy of leading the country or being an MP?! We're not all childless by choice! :(
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papinian
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Re: Jane Ellison Article 50

Postby papinian » Tue Jan 31, 2017 6:47 pm

Misty, I'm not going to get into a fight either, but I repeat what I said about Jane Ellison:
To most people it's obvious that someone who has chosen to spend her entire working life of almost 20 years at a single employer is not someone who is going to be particularly independent-minded but rather someone who tows the line.
My point regarding Jane Ellison not having children is that staying at the same employer is somewhat more understandable if you have children than if you don't.

It's pretty over the top for you to describe this as a "personal character assassination of the way she has conducted her life ". At no point did I criticise her life choices - I simply said that to me they suggest that she is not going to be a very independent-minded MP and, of course, I am being proved right.
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vixen22
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Re: Jane Ellison Article 50

Postby vixen22 » Tue Jan 31, 2017 10:02 pm

petal wrote:It's like yesterday's news...get over it.
What a profoundly dismissive and arrogant thing to say.

Luckily not everyone feels the same way as you Petal. I'll be holding my MP to account and will continue to do so for as long as I live in this country. It's as much my democratic right as it is my duty. I implore anyone else that also feels as strongly to do the same.
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Punctured Bicycle
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Re: Jane Ellison Article 50

Postby Punctured Bicycle » Wed Feb 01, 2017 12:52 am

I'm sure the posters on this forum are smart enough to appreciate there was an instruction, in a deeply flawed referendum, to leave the European Union. The government is trying to implement this instruction but needs to pass legislation in both Houses of Parliament. Only Parliament can change the law of the land as was determined in the recent Miller case. Government attempts to railroad Parliament and bypass the Constitution (yes we do have one) shows their level of desperation and/or ignorance. If you followed Parliament today many still think it is a bad idea but will vote in favour as they seem to fall into the fiction that the 'Decision' has been made. The People's Challenge group is trying to educate MPs in the gravity of the current situation and full extent of rights which will be lost as a result of ending the EU Treaties. Even if we do Brexit there must be proper control and scrutiny along the way. If you can contribute even a few pounds that would help along the way.

https://www.crowdjustice.org/case/parli ... e-control/
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Paddy123
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Re: Jane Ellison Article 50

Postby Paddy123 » Wed Feb 01, 2017 9:45 am

I didnt know Andrea levinson was a nappy valley poster under the guise of Papinian!
Joking aside, I'm not sure how his/hers offensive opinions are allowed to be posted on this forum. Its not a fear of healthy debate but cruel targeting of childless, gay, minority groups. Shame on you.

Anyway, back to the business of article 50. I know its going to happen but how it happens is extremely important. Feel free to cut and paste/adapt/edit the email I sent to Jane Ellison yesterday (email: jane.ellison.mp@parliament.uk)

Dear Jane,

I along with over 75% of your constituents and 48% of voters in the country voted in favour of the UK remaining within the European Union. I also voted for you and the conservative party in the general election.  Like many others (including many who voted leave) I have watched in dismay at the audacity of the 'bait-and-switch' being perpetrated by the extreme elements within the Conservative party intent on leveraging a marginal referendum victory into an extreme and isolationist re-casting of our approach to relations with our closest neighbours. It is appears increasingly clear that this small element is determined to force through their version of Brexit regardless of whether the country is supportive of the final deal (as evidenced by the hysterical reaction to even minor inconveniences such as the recent supreme court ruling). Given the narrow referendum margin, the widespread misinformation prior to the vote, and the enormous long term consequences of Brexit it is only reasonable that the final deal is ratified by both parliament and the British public.
 
In my view, the Article 50 bill as presented will allow the government to effectively rule by decree on the biggest issue facing Battersea and our country as a whole.  This cannot be right.  Implementation of the referendum result requires many trade-offs between different groups with competing priorities.  When I voted for you in the general election, I was voting for you to stand up for the best interests of Battersea.  This means, during the coming negotiations and compromises that will be required, I voted for you to be my voice in parliament representing my interests.  This means it cannot be right that the government is given a “blank cheque” to make these trade-offs without further reference to you and your fellow MPs to present their views.
 
In recent days it has been encouraging to see an increasing number of your fellow MPs putting their principles ahead of party politics by saying that they will defy the party whip to vote against Article 50, or to table amendments which would allow for further scrutiny. I very much hope that in the upcoming vote you will represent the views of the majority of your constituents by voting against the motion, unless it is amended to ensure that the final deal is put to the public. Only a post-negotiation referendum will allow the public the full facts to assess whether the real consequences of Brexit is preferable to remaining within the EU.
 
I hope that in relation to the generation-defining issue you will consider the big picture and vote with your conscience to ensure that Britain is not steamrollered into a an extreme version of Brexit against the will of the majority of the British people.
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Hyde Ranger
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Re: Jane Ellison Article 50

Postby Hyde Ranger » Wed Feb 01, 2017 9:54 am

I feel so fed up with hearing people say 'the people have spoken, this was democracy', etc. (Incidentally, I wonder if Farage and the Tory Eurosceptics would be taking that view had the vote gone a very few percentage points the other way...). It's so disingenuous.This was a travesty of a referendum - I have lived in this country for 25 years and it's the first I can remember here. It struck me through the whole run up and aftermath that not least because they are such a rare occurrence here people were treating the process like a by-election: that is, as a stick to beat the incumbents with, and as a means by which to air unrelated grievances, without realising that this vote was not just to fill one constituency for five years, but to massively change our country's place in the world and our children's futures. I have lived in two countries where referenda are actually a part of the political process, and believe me, they do not lead to sweeping constitutional changes on a tiny overall majority such as this one.
My MP is Chuka Umunna, and his constituency is in the area that had the highest remain vote in the country. How is it 'democracy' for him not to recognise that? 16,000 people may have 'spoken', but can politicians and the media please stop pretending that the 48 percent who voted 'remain' didn't, and no longer have any political voice?
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Hyde Ranger
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Re: Jane Ellison Article 50

Postby Hyde Ranger » Wed Feb 01, 2017 9:56 am

Also, fabulous email, Paddy.
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vixen22
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Re: Jane Ellison Article 50

Postby vixen22 » Wed Feb 01, 2017 10:21 am

Hyde Ranger wrote:can politicians and the media please stop pretending that the 48 percent who voted 'remain' didn't, and no longer have any political voice?
Thank you for this.
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Flowermummy
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Re: Jane Ellison Article 50

Postby Flowermummy » Wed Feb 01, 2017 10:22 am

paddy123, thank you for sharing the email!
I have just sent JE a very similar one :)
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BFW
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Re: Jane Ellison Article 50

Postby BFW » Wed Feb 01, 2017 10:37 am

Thank you Paddy - I have also sent her an e mail.

Sadly I doubt it will make any difference - but she is not representing the will of her Wandsworth Constituents!
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SWpoet
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Re: Jane Ellison Article 50

Postby SWpoet » Wed Feb 01, 2017 11:14 am

FYI this is the position of Tooting MP, Dr Allin Khan - cut and pasted from an email from her to the local Labour Party:

We live in a representative democracy, where an MP represents the interests and the will of local people. That's why I believe that respecting the EU Referendum result means my job is to act in a way that reflects how the people of Tooting voted.

Across Wandsworth, over 100,000 people (75%) voted to Remain in the EU. That’s why tonight I will vote against the triggering Article 50.
Facebook: My full statement
Twitter: Latest updates
After a vote like the referendum, the decision of the majority must be respected, but what follows must be done in the best interest of all. Yes, the decision to leave the EU was made by 52%, but the form of Brexit must take the interests of 100% of people into consideration.

It’s becoming clear that the Prime Minister is pursuing an extreme version of Brexit that she does not have a mandate for. Everything is up for grabs, from our access to the Single Market and workers’ rights to the NHS and the rights of our friends, family and colleagues who happen to be EU citizens.

Given these enormous challenges and decisions we face as a country, we need our political system to work more than ever – to ensure that everyone has a voice. As long as I am MP for Balham, Earlsfield, Furzedown, Tooting and Wandsworth, I promise to be your voice in Parliament.

Therefore, while I fully expect Parliament as a whole to vote to trigger Article 50, tonight, I will be voting against the triggering Article 50.

I hope that you can understand my decision, thank you for taking the time to read this.

Wishing you all the best,

Rosena

Dr Rosena Allin-Khan MP
Labour MP for Tooting
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papinian
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Re: Jane Ellison Article 50

Postby papinian » Wed Feb 01, 2017 12:02 pm

papinian wrote:I for one am not comfortable with a childless Prime Minister and childless Secretary of State for Education deciding education policy. There are currently as many gay ministers in the Department for Education as there are ministers who have children of their own.
Paddy123: You need to get over yourself if you think the above statement as
cruel targeting of childless, gay, minority groups.
which should not be permitted on this site.

As I have already said, the backlash to the "culture of offence" which you exhibit, i.e. trying to shut people up because they hurt your feelings, was one of the contributors to the Brexit referendum result. Think about that.
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windmill26
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Re: Jane Ellison Article 50

Postby windmill26 » Wed Feb 01, 2017 12:29 pm

SWpoet wrote:FYI this is the position of Tooting MP, Dr Allin Khan - cut and pasted from an email from her to the local Labour Party:

We live in a representative democracy, where an MP represents the interests and the will of local people. That's why I believe that respecting the EU Referendum result means my job is to act in a way that reflects how the people of Tooting voted.

Across Wandsworth, over 100,000 people (75%) voted to Remain in the EU. That’s why tonight I will vote against the triggering Article 50.
Facebook: My full statement
Twitter: Latest updates
After a vote like the referendum, the decision of the majority must be respected, but what follows must be done in the best interest of all. Yes, the decision to leave the EU was made by 52%, but the form of Brexit must take the interests of 100% of people into consideration.

It’s becoming clear that the Prime Minister is pursuing an extreme version of Brexit that she does not have a mandate for. Everything is up for grabs, from our access to the Single Market and workers’ rights to the NHS and the rights of our friends, family and colleagues who happen to be EU citizens.

Given these enormous challenges and decisions we face as a country, we need our political system to work more than ever – to ensure that everyone has a voice. As long as I am MP for Balham, Earlsfield, Furzedown, Tooting and Wandsworth, I promise to be your voice in Parliament.

Therefore, while I fully expect Parliament as a whole to vote to trigger Article 50, tonight, I will be voting against the triggering Article 50.

I hope that you can understand my decision, thank you for taking the time to read this.

Wishing you all the best,

Rosena

Dr Rosena Allin-Khan MP
Labour MP for Tooting
Very happy to read this!
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