Advice please Post Reply

[WorriedDad]

Hello
As a local father/husband I could do with some advice.

I'm married to a lovely woman who is the mother of my two children (I've changed the numbers/sex so that its not obvious) and I work in the City.

To be honest I am extremely well paid and whilst I know we are very very lucky we're not untypical for the area: children at private schools, nice cars, three holidays a year etc etc.

The problem I have is I have to work extremely hard to provide all this (my wife doesn't work) and whilst I am pretty good at my job I'm not a natural so the personal cost in terms of stress and effort is pretty considerable.

That means at weekends I am absolutely knackered and its really Saturday night before I have any energy again.

This probably sounds really petty but every Saturday my wife insists I do everything with the kids (get them up, breakfast, take them swimming etc, lunch) so that she has some "time for her" as she has been childcaring all week.

Don't get me wrong, I would normally choose to do this anyway (I don't see them in the week) but I wouldn't mind a lie in every now and then

What I'm finding hard to express without an argument kicking off (and I have tried) is that the physical and mental cost of what I do means I need some time off as well and it's not as though I spend my time messing around at work and just relaxing. She seems to think business trips are jollies and client lunches a bit of fun (I hate both btw).

How do I gentle explain that actually we could both do with some "down time" at weekends and that its not a case of one person "dumping" on the other.

Thanks and apologies if rambling

[txmum]

I think you neither one are approaching it from the other's perspective. I can only give you my own, woman's perspective on needing time away from the kids for what its worth. Don't get me wrong, dads need to unwind too, but work is definitely not harder than motherhood, i promise you that. I work full time at a demanding and stressful city job. However, I find going to work to be a luxurious, daily 10 hour vacation from the demands of motherhood.
Why is work awesome?
I get to eat lunch. Not just eat lunch in peace, not just eat my choice of takeaways lined up opposite my office...I get to actually eat lunch with two hands and finish it to my satisfaction without having to stop my meal because i have to coerce a small child into eating their own meal, perhaps actually spoon feed them despite the fact they've been wiling and able to feed themselves for two years, but today they need airplane noises to eat, and without having to rush to get it all done before all hell breaks loose because you're running in to nap time.
I get to have adult conversations. Even if its about seriously boring crap, it is thousands of times more stimulating than acting excited because Ben and Holly are on TV or you've just read the same Peppa Pig book with the pig snort button for the 75th time that week. Board books have no plot structure. They are not stimulating. And the usual "how was your day"/standard grunted reply you get with hubby at the end of the day does not qualify as stimulating adult conversation.
I drink tea without worrying that my child will find it, spill it on himself, and be physically maimed for the rest of his life.
I get to go to the toilet without a child sitting on my knees. And yes, I mean poop too. I'm not really that comfortable pooping at work, but I sure don't get to do it alone at home without company. If I wanted to poop at work, I could do it. Alone. And it would be fabulous. Also at work I never have to stop short of doing my business to chase after a small child who has found the outlet cover that the cleaner left off (again) and runs off saying "I put back!" While you run after them with urine dribbling down your leg and your pants around your ankles just so your darling firstborn doesn't electrocute themselves trying to be helpful. Yes I just discussed my toilet activities in a public forum. I lost all sense of personal shame during childbirth after no fewer than 8 different people stuck their hands up me in the space of 24 hours.

Motherhood requires putting the needs of another small human being ahead of your own basic needs for survival. And that's hard work, which never. Lets. Up. Ever. Mums need a break too.

Before anyone slams me, I love my son to the depths of my soul and I love being his mother even more. I love that a few soft words and a cuddle are enough to make any tears turn into laughter. I love watching him grow and discover the world. I love every single minute of it...even the tedious and sometimes excruciating ones.

Stay at home moms have the hardest job in the world. I have nothing but total respect and admiration for those who do it. But you never, ever get a break from motherhood, and sometimes you just need a little physical separation from the "activities" of motherhood to remember your own name, to breathe out, and maybe possibly relax for just a few minutes.

[hol78]

TX Mum - you had me in hysterics with your post but I think there is a lot of truth in what you say .

What about getting a nanny to help out on saturday morning and perhaps by the sounds of things (sorry to state the obvious) you need the odd adult weekend away somewhere you can both have time out !

[balhamite]

Great reply TX Mum. You have articulated it perfectly. Made me laugh and cry.

[WorriedDad]

Thanks for the kind reply.

I guess the issue I have is that I don't see staying at home as any harder than what I do, there aren't many people doing what I do, but there are a lot of people doing other things.

So I think you're right that there is a balance to be had

[erinisle22]

My husband thinks as you do (wait...are you my husband?!)

Thanks TXmum, what you write really resonates with me.

Until you do the stay at home mum thing, it is really hard to understand how a break is necessary, but I can tell you, it is. I have had one day off (and not even a full one as I am still breast feeding) in almost 8 months and sleep deprivation and my husband's thoughts that my life is all about catching up with my friends and having coffees is so far from the truth of my life that I want to scream at times. He thinks it is fun and easy, that I get the best job being with our kids but he's not looked after them sole handed once, nor does he plan to (mum, do you want to come and stay the weekend she goes away?) and the TV is rarely off when he's in charge...

[csml]

I agree with Worried Dad - being a full time mother and holding down a full time city job are equally as difficult and stressful in totally different ways.

Whilst I totally identify with TX Mum's feelings that going to the toilet in peace would be total bliss, from Worried Dad's perspective being able to say "no" to a demanding client (or a demanding child) or going being able to be outside during daylight hours rather than sitting in a claustrophobic office (you get very little privacy in an office too!) would be equally blissful which is something that a stay at home mother can do every day.

It's very easy to see how thinking the grass is greener can lead to a difficult conversation but I agree that you are just as entitled to time out from your job, as your wife is from hers. Can you have an arrangement whereby you alternate weekends? And can you afford to hire a childminder or find a Saturday morning activity class which your wife can drop the kids off at on her way to her "me time"?

Whatever solution you find, I think you are being perfectly reasonable in what you are asking for. The most important thing is to stay calm, try not to get into a competition about who's life is more difficult, and focus on finding practical soluctions.

Good luck - you sound like a really nice and sensitive man so I hope you and your wife can find a way to make you both happy!

[WorriedDad]

Hi
I think that is my issue, I got into trouble on my last business trip because I hadn't brought back a gift. We landed at 11pm on a Sunday evening and went straight into a series of meetings and dinners until I landed on Friday evening.

Her argument was that she'd googled the hotel and found out it was some posh five star number and complained that when was the last time she'd had a stay on her own in a smart hotel and I'd obviously been having such a great time I hadn't had time to buy her a present.

In a week where there are tennis clubs and personal trainers for her I felt one of us had more me time and it wasn't me in some Far East hotel.

WD

btw am at doctors this morning hence able to type before anyone says "how come if you're so busy...

[NYE31]

I have been a full time stay at home Mum whilst on Maternity Leave & I am now a full time working Mum with a very demanding high powered job. Probably more so than my husband who also works full time.

Since our son started at nursery, we take it in turns to have a lie in, mine is a Sat am & my husband's is a Sun am, we tend to both go to swimming, ruggerbeez etc as we like watching & it's part of our family time.

For me, I would much rather be at home with my son but not an option, going off to work, being in meetings, travelling with work, having to think about what to wear, being away, leaving home early & getting back late is really hard not to mention dealing with demanding clients, difficult stakeholders & managing a large team toegther with trying to be there for your child & spending quality time with them.

No wonder "I don't know she does it" was such a popular book & film

I think balance, a mutual appreciation of what you both do & open communication is key.

Perhaps you could have your lie in on a Sat & she has hers on a Sun and you could share the activities.

Good luck

[supergirl]

Hi WorriedDad

May i say, you are a very good man as you have obviously been very kind putting your children abd wife first.

I understand both side because we have the same dynamic at home. Your wife wants some respite from her work (even though she most probably adores being with her children) and you want some respite too.
Sorry if i sound patronising or condescendant but you both need to understand:
1. You both work very hard, it is not a competition
2. Her works mean she is just with the kids (depending on ages), even if she has a network it is not like being at work being part of a team. But she has no deadline, stress, pressure
3. Your work mean that you can get the odd beer after work (friday lunchtime at Bank, virtually all the pubs were full of men having a beer last week!), you talk to adults every day. But being the sole breadwinner AND being on a high salary, you get all the pressure and responsabilities.

So you need to divide the week end.

My husband chose to give me a lie in in Saturday mirning. In theory it means that up until lunchtime i do as i please and he is with the kids. In practice i rarely do it because i like breakfast the 4 of us and thrn chilling playing board games or playing silly! The rest of thd day is family time and we are out and sbout. Sunday is his lie in until 12.30. He sleeps then go to exercise and come back for lunch. The rest of the day is family time. After bedtime on sunday he works to prepare the week.
Friday evening is our date night (he goes to a class on friday early evenings to kick off the week end) and saturday evening we socialise or catch up.

What you need is to make the week end work for you two. If you both understand what the other needs it will work.

Sorry for thr novel. Good luck. Sx

[supergirl]

I should add i am guilty of having told my husband a couple of times "niiiiiice so you went to Claridges for breakfast, so you went to the GlenEagle for 3 days, so you re going to NYC and you ll be staying at the plaza..." Yep i ve said that. One day i was invited so i join the black tie dinner... And i saw it a room where i counted 10 women (i counted) dressed in black and 65 men in black. Thats when he told me that he wpuld rather go to all this places with me rather than work... But he has to.
As for presents: when he works he has no time so for his next trip i ll be buying online (with his card) or will give him the exact ref of what i want for him to get at the duty free.
BUT
You have to give flowers for no reason or the odd perfume from the duty free. That is NOT difficult and takes 5 min.
Every men can do that. Mine can.

[Writerlady]

Hi worried Dad
I really feel for you. I work almost full time but have done the stay at home mum bit for years before that. As stated both are hard in different ways, and i have to admit to finding working easier, however, my job is not as hardcore as yours, and mine is the secondary income.

I can totally see your point of view. I agree staying at home with tinies is very full on, as so brilliantly described in previous posts, but you say yours are at school, so i assume your wife has some time to herself in the day? Or maybe they are not all at school. I am really not taking sides, as i have been your wife (i shamefully rang my husband at work at 9pm one evening in tears and ordered him to come home.) However, as i have realised over the years, my husband does not choose to work the hours he does, but HAS to, in order to keep his family in the manner to which they have become accustomed. However horrible it is charging round the house with wee running down your legs, i would suggest it is more horrible feeling the terrifying daily pressure of knowing how hard you need to work as the sole breadwinner supporting an extravagant lifestyle. The wee running down your legs stage will end, but, i would hazard, the bills for school and tennis clubs will remain, and indeed increase with each passing year. And you, perhaps, need a bit of a break in order to be sufficiently on form every Monday to battle your way through the week and bring home the bacon.

I would like to say bowever, that i probably only came to this view having come through the baby and toddler years, which i found very very hard.

[supergirl]

Well said WriterLady. Exactly what i meant in much less words

[supergirl]

BTW anither thing you could is to take your wife for a lunchdate. We do that about once a term. He book 2-3hrs in his diary. He organises everything and then just give a tube station where to meet.
It ALWAYS gives me butterflies in my tummy! She needs to feel you re not taking her for granted.

[WorriedDad]

Some top advice

thank you