Thomas's Clapham Ballot Rigged? Post Reply

[sophocles]

Does anyone know whether the Thomas's Clapham ballot is legitimate or whether it's rigged? They say that they close the Main list when there are approximately three places available for every applicant. However, we know a huge amount of people who failed to get a place and none who got one, which means it's almost impossible that the odds of getting in genuinely are anywhere close to 1 in 3. If the odds are very different it feels somewhat fraudulent given they charge £100 to enter the ballot.

Would be interested to hear if anyone else had a different experience of the ballot.

[Muddywaters]

As someone with their child at thomas’s, I’d say it’s not worth stressing about. People are fleeing. It’s not what it was, and it’s a cash cow now. Go choose a better school.

[SherrySmyth]

Muddywaters is right. You may want to consider another school.
The children of Thomas's original founders who run the school now, aledgedly, mismanaged the school finances. They, again alledgedly, accepted a huge number of students to collect fees and promising a new school, which was not really in their plans. Nevertheless, in April 2023, Thomas's was sold partially to Private Equity to cover its debts. Private Equity also aquired control over financial decisions.
All those events were accompanied by significant degradation of school services, it impacted kids and parents... That is a sad story...

[sophocles]

Thanks Muddywaters and Sherry. That's really interesting to know. We obviously had concerns about safeguarding at the schools after all the terrible things came out in court about the deputy head at the Battersea school, but we always thought that, from an academic point of view, the school was still well regarded.

[Muddywaters]

Half our current class is in tutoring and the children’s grasp on things like math and spelling is abysmal. Don’t believe the hype.

[Btc_mum]

We are current Thomas’s parents, and are incredibly happy with the school. The new headmaster is wonderful, and the teaching staff at large are exceptional
Of course large sections of classes are tutored, because that is sadly now the norm for many families, especially leading up to exam time. The same would be true for any school around here, and is reflective of local parents rather than the standard of teaching.

Re the ballot, the waiting list doesn’t take into account siblings of existing children, so like with any other school, state or private, you are largely at the mercy of how many sibling places get allocated first.
Then of course with Thomas’s, they have their very carefully balanced process which takes into account birth month and whether the child is a boy or girl.

For what it’s worth, we know a couple of families who got a place in the ballot a few weeks ago with no prior connection to the school other than living locally, so I have no reason to think anything is rigged. But if you have autumn-born children, their chances of getting a place are going to be a lot lower than those with summer birthdays for obvious reasons

I’m also slightly perplexed by the comments saying there has been an exodus of children leaving the school.
We have children and friends across several years, and haven’t seen or heard of this. There are always a few who leave, usually to relocate outside of London but nothing that suggests any large level of dissatisfaction with the school.
Who knows if that number will increase with the cost of living crisis though.

[Btc_mum]

We are current Thomas’s parents, and are incredibly happy with the school. The new headmaster is wonderful, and the teaching staff at large are exceptional
Of course large sections of classes are tutored, because that is sadly now the norm for many families, especially leading up to exam time. The same would be true for any school around here, and is reflective of local parents rather than the standard of teaching.

Re the ballot, the waiting list doesn’t take into account siblings of existing children, so like with any other school, state or private, you are largely at the mercy of how many sibling places get allocated first.
Then of course with Thomas’s, they have their very carefully balanced process which takes into account birth month and whether the child is a boy or girl.

For what it’s worth, we know a couple of families who got a place in the ballot a few weeks ago with no prior connection to the school other than living locally, so I have no reason to think anything is rigged. But if you have autumn-born children, their chances of getting a place are going to be a lot lower than those with summer birthdays for obvious reasons

I’m also slightly perplexed by the comments saying there has been an exodus of children leaving the school.
We have children and friends across several years, and haven’t seen or heard of this. There are always a few who leave, usually to relocate outside of London but nothing that suggests any large level of dissatisfaction with the school.
Who knows if that number will increase with the cost of living crisis though.

[Expatacular]

Agree with Btc_mum. Some of the PP comments do not reflect our own experience with the school. Our child is happy, thriving both academically and socially, and bounces into and out of school every day. The teachers are impressive, as is the senior leadership team. In conversation with other parents, adults and children alike are happy.

We had no previous connection with the school, our child didn't attend one of the well-known local nurseries that tend to send many kids to Thomas's each year, and we are not in any way famous or remarkable. Our child did not get in on the initial ballot draw but got a place off the wait-list about a month after the initial ballot draw. There is a lot of movement on the wait-list every year, including pupils who get a place right up to the start of the school year. I understand why someone might think there's some rigging of the system (I admit I wondered as well), but "from the other side" I really don't think there is.

[Btw78]

“ Of course large sections of classes are tutored, because that is sadly now the norm for many families, especially leading up to exam time. ”
This says it all! They pay thousands on fees and on the top of that they heavily tutor their kids. How they can say this is an academically sound school? They prepare exams against kids who go to state schools and are tutored and they do enter ahead of Thomas’ kids. If I was a parent I would really ask myself. But of course it is the prestige to say your kids went to the same school as the royals, which is really what drives the waiting list. And what drove a PE to invest in it, as it is obviously a cash cow, like a luxury bag.
Re the waiting list, the get the siblings, then families they know or are aware of and then the rest, so changes is you are nobody is slim.

[this_is_cat]

Tutoring children before exams isn’t unique to Thomas’s!

It has become the norm now at pretty much every state and primary school in the area, especially before exams.

Children are being tutored in core subjects ahead of the Transfer test for state secondaries now, let alone before 11+ and 13+ exams.

It‘s nothing to do with the school and teaching quality, and everything to do with the arms race that is secondary places.

As an anecdote, a former colleague of mine moved to the countryside during lockdown, moving their 3 kids from Thomas’s to a well-known Bath school and said all were automatically put into top sets without taking exams, because their new school assumed that the children would all be academically excellent after many years of Thomas’s education, so the reputation for good teaching is wider than just SW London

[Schoolpost2022]

Just the fact that its owned by a PE should raise red flag ! Its just plainly wrong. Have said this before on other posts but do not underestimate the difference in a privately owned (or worse PE Owned) school and a school that is run as a trust. Everyone knows that PE companies are interested in one thing one = making a profit.

[this_is_cat]

It’s not ‘owned by a PE company’

A PE company has taken a minority share in the last few weeks

As far as I’m aware, the only trust-owned schools locally are Finton and Hornsby. Both not without their own issues, and charging very similar fees (and making identical fee hikes) to the schools owned by Dukes and those which are privately owned

But regardless, it seems very strange for anyone considering private schools to decide that capitalism is suddenly the red line they won’t cross in their quest to spend £1m per child for their education..!

[Schoolpost2022]

Sorry to correct you but Thomas Clapham for a start is over £1,000 more expesive per term than Honrsby and Finton - its a fact and you can compare the numbers on their websites. On top of that schools that are trusts tend to have free school clubs whilst most PE owned schools tend to make you pay for every single club. May seem like a small thing but that can add up to quite a significant amount with 3 kids each with a couple of clubs per week,

I have DIRECT experience (no hearsay / nor my friend said) of this having had 2 kids at one of these PE owned schools and having taken my 3rd out to attend Hornsby. The difference was unbelievable. Happier staff, better facilities, and a complete different feel.

So capitalistm is not suddenly a red line - my red line is lining pockets of PE companies whilst my preference is for profits to be reinvested in school facilities and in staff renumeration.

Then of course is down to individual to make their own decision - this is my opinion and you clearly disagree which is also completely fine.