Not sure about St George's... Post Reply

[EmmaVictoriaID]

Hi all

I'm 3 and a half months pregnant with my first baby and live 5 mins from St George's.

I would like a water birth with the option of an epidural if I want one. I like the sound of the Carmen Suite very much (I know I'd have to move to a different place for an epidural - which isn't ideal, but do-able) but was told by a midwife at my appointment today that it's first come, first serve and I might not get a place there because there are only 2 rooms. That's really bothering me. I don't want to turn up with a plan in mind to be told there's no room at the inn and then get shoved on to the labour ward.

Has anyone been turned away from there before? I'm due in July, apparently this isn't a 'busy period' but I just feel that making any plans for my labour is pointless if they can just put me where they like.

Also does anyone know of anywhere where you can have a water birth and epidural without having to move or is that only really an option if you go private (which is a reluctant option)

Experiences and thoughts greatfully received!

Emma

[2009Kat]

Emma, this isn't really a reply about St Georges but I just wanted to say I think this is the case at most hospitals. I had my baby at St Thomas's but there was no room in the "home from home" (which is I think their equivalent of the Carmen suite) so I had no choice but to go to the labour ward as this was where the first room became available. The midwives were very apologetic as I was apparently a perfect candidate for the home from home (no problems etc) and they wanted to help me have the sort of birth I wanted - although I did end up with an emergency c-section but that's another story. I guess my point is that you can have a birth plan and whilst you should fight to get your own way, if there is no room, there is just no room!

[moops]

Hello

I agree that the Carmen Suite and other Home from Home type rooms seem to be on a first come first served basis so there really isn't much you can do if it's being used whilst you are there.

On a different note, I was nearly turned away from St George's altogether when I was in labour with my Son as they had no beds! Here is a link to some comments about St George's and St Thomas's.

http://www.nappyvalleynet.com/post10291.html#p10291

[MrsAmanda]

Hi Emma

I've had one child at St Thomas' and one at St George's. With both of them, and I think this is pretty much the case throughout the NHS, it's first come, first served. As babies don't come to a schedule, there isn't really any other way around it.

If you do start with a water birth, then decide you need an epidural, St Thomas' you only move around the corner, at St George's you move 3 floors!

I had my first child, at St T's, in Jan 09. It was heaving and was just about fully booked. My second, at St G's was last October. When I arrived at the Carmen Suite, I was the only person there. I had to be transferred to the Delivery Suite, but post-natal I was back in Carmen, and again was the only person there for the first night.
One of the midwives told me the previous week they were turning labouring women away as they were so full, but then a few days later they were empty. It's very much luck of the draw.

You talk about making plans for your labour. With my first, I had quite a detailed birth plan and knew exactly what I wanted. Well, guess what, it all went out of the window. My advice would be not to get too het up about how you want your birth to go, as there's a good chance it won't happen that way.

Incidentally, whilst the medical teams at both hospitals were great, the midwives at St G's were far nicer than those at St Ts. My second child had to spend some time in Neo-natal intensive care at St G's, and they were absolutely fantastic.

[ready2pop]

As everyone else has said I think all NHS home from home units are always oversubscribed so there is always a chance they will be full on the day you go in, in which case I think there is a lot to be said for just going for the one nearest you.

I had both mine in St George's (complicated pregnancies so no chance of anything other than labour ward) and can't praise the midwives enough.

[Twirly]

I had a water birth with my first baby in the Carmen Suite - i couldn't praise them more. I didn't have a birth plan - i liked the idea of a water birth, said that's what i wanted when i rang up in mid-labour and that's what i got.

Must echo the idea of the labour plan - so many things can change - don't be strict on yourself and just go with the flow. I don't know how anyone can know what they want during labour until they experience their own personal version of it.

You'll need to express a desire to use Carmen suite later in your pregnancy and they colour code your file if you're suitable (don't have low iron, not expecting a big baby etc!)

[Raspberry-Sorbet]

I wouldn't worry too much about which room etc. When you are in throws of labour, it all slightly blurs and you may suddenly feel repelled by the idea of getting in the water or be in it the whole time (how quickly your body labours will determine that!) It's such an unknown thing until you are doing it....The people around you will make much more of an impact on your experiences. Good midwives are key.

I wish that someone had said to me to not focus on the birth too much, the baby is coming out one way or another (of course most important is that the baby arrives safely) there is a much wider picture of breastfeeding and how tricky that can be to start with, baby's nappy contents, umbilical cord stump, what does each cry mean.......the list goes on.

But of course it is a happy list, I don't mean to in any way sound negative but perhaps mums could do with more post natal support. Community Midwives can be illusive. Enjoy your precious bundle when he / she arrives. It is such a special time.

I really liked reading, The Official Lamaze Guide. American book, very empowering. Not at all prescriptive but gives a positive angle on every delivery outcome.

Also The Continuum Concept. This stopped me worrying about routines and holding my babies too much!

[AliMidwife]

Have you thought about having your baby at St Helier? exactly the same thing with first come first serve with the Birth Centre. They have a brand new birth centre opend up in the past year and its on the same floor as the labour ward so if you need an epidural you literally just move you one room down and they can call the anaesthetist. Have you also looked into antenatal classes yet? Have a look at the website www.antenatalclass.net if your interested!

[lrsmum]

Emma, I live quite close to St George's and for the very same reasons as you, decided on St Thomas'! In the end, I had to be monitored during labour due to my BP going up so the home from home unit wasn't an option anyway and I had an awful experience, understaffed (almost negligent), shortage of beds, rude staff and none of my friends had any of these experiences at St George's. Not to mention the countless journey's back and forth to St Thomas'. In the throws of labour I would have given anything for a 5 min journey not a 1/2 hour one! I have sworn that the next baby will be born at whatever hospital is nearest!!! Good luck.

[EmmaVictoriaID]

Thanks so much everyone. I realise I probably sound somewhat neurotic , I am known for being a bit of a control freak and luckily have six months to get my head around the fact that ultimately the baby will decide what happens not me and as long as it arrives safely being comfortable is a bonus!

I think I will go ahead with St George's, it is so close and most feedback is good.

To be honest I was put off yesterday as I had my first midwife appointment and, as expected, it was all quite rushed and procedural, she was meant to listen to the baby's heartbeat and got me on the bed and held it there for about 5 seconds, there was clearly no noise but she said "oh I heard it"... and then went on to tell me they're so busy and you "might" get this and that. And the midwives I meet for my ante natal care are not the same people who will be delivering, not even a chance, so building up some kind of relationship with a professional is not an option. I just felt really deflated. I've not had a good experience with the people I've met so far, it's all rush, rush and you just wonder if they're like this now then what will they be like when it really hits the fan!

I know it's just the state of the NHS at the moment and they're understaffed etc. but I just didn't feel confident. I know the NHS is a darn sight better than a lot of other countries in the world and actually we really are quite lucky, I just felt a bit down yesterday and wanted some realistic feedback. So thanks everyone xx

[MrsAmanda]

Oh, you sound just like me when I was pregnant with my first. I like to know exactly what's happening and when, and couldn't get my head around the fact the baby was making the decisions for me!

To be honest, if you want continuity of care when it comes to midwives, you need to move! Throughout my first pregnancy, under St Ts, I rarely saw the same community midwife twice. St G's team (I was 'yellow') was a bit better but there was no 'relationship' and none of them got to know me, and my pregnancy at all. Having said that, post-natally, I had the same midwife with both of my pregnancies, so there is some continuity there.

I know exactly what you mean about it all feeling rushed. I very much felt like I was just a number throughout both my pregnancies. However, I will say that St G's very rarely kept me waiting for my appointments, which was a good thing.

No matter how frantic it all seems, the midwives and medics I had through both of my labours were absolutely brilliant.

If you do want continuity, perhaps think of hiring a private midwife or doula. They'll be with you throughout the pregnancy and during labour. They'll know your preferences about what you do/don't want to happen, and can be your eyes and ears with the hospital staff when you're too out of it to speak! It's cheaper than a private birth and might be an option. I didn't do it, and wish I had. My husband was great, but at times having someone with us who knew what's what would have been helpful.

I've heard of one GP practice in Clapham with excellent midwifery team, who are better than most at giving you continuous care, but I can't remember its name, and you'd obviously have to be within it's catchment area for it to be of any use.

[yorkshirepudding]

Hi,
I agree with all of the former comments, when you actually come to having the baby all of your plans tend to go out of the window!

My first was in distress during a very long labour and I was in the delivery suite at St Georges, it was packed, we had to wait literally hours for a room (I was being monitored in waiting rooms full of people) and although it was extremely stressful and a very long labour, the staff were excellent. My baby was delivered via ventouse with a whole team of people there to help out. Post natally it was a nightmare and I had very little care or attention and as a result went home without learning to breastfeed and had a lot of problems. During labour I had had an epidural (total no no according to my birth plan!) but boy was I pleased I did!

With our second child I was adamant I wanted to give birth in the "new" Carmen Suite and have a more positive experience all round. However, when we arrived there they were short staffed and I was told we couldn't stay as there weren't enough midwives. Because I was stressed, in pain and being totally neurotic... the absolutely lovely midwife at the Carmen Suite allowed me to labour in one of their empty rooms - I ended up delivering there as it all happened very fast - I know she shouldn't have let me but I'm so pleased that she did as it was fantastic. The aftercare was nothing short of superb and I was helped right through the night - leaving the following day with a chilled, happy baby who I was able to feed with no problem!

I guess I have had both experiences and would say that although St George's is regularly overstretched and the post natal care can be dodgy, I felt, both times, that the welfare of me and my baby during labour and childbirth was always paramount and for that reason I would recommend them!

[dandelion53]

I had my baby in the Carmen Suite. Both rooms were empty when I arrived so there was no problem at all. It was a great but I know I was lucky that they weren't busy.
But like you, I was really disappointed by the midwives I had for ante-natal care, very rushed and said exactly the same thing about not banking on a birthing pool as you 'get what you get'. They never seemed interested and didn't seem keen to even discuss a birth plan. To be honest I felt like I could have just done my urine tests and blood pressure at home myself and be done with it. But the contrast with the midwives I had during labour was huge - they were lovely and so attentive, kind etc etc. It didn't matter one bit that I had never met them before.
Like you, I was really worried by the antenatal midwives and looked into getting a doula to advocate for me what I wanted once I was in labour and possibly unable to do so. But I looked into it far too late and couldn't find one that was available. I recommend you look into it as soon as possible if you're interested, I think it might put your mind at rest having a doula to speak for you so that in case you can't get a pool on the day, you still stay calm. At the end of the day, other than the pool the rooms are still pretty similar to those on the labour ward. I think the labour ward also has a big oversized bath that you can use, not as good as a pool but could help?
The only way to guarantee a water birth is to have a home birth and hire a pool or go privately - have you looked at The Birth Centre, its right by st georges so if there are any problems during your labour they can just transfer you to the hospital. Very expensive though!

[Sam001]

Hi,

I gave birth (first baby) at Chelsea last July and like you I had high expectations about the birth and also wanted a water birth, and I had a very detailed birth plan. Unfortunately, the birth plan goes out of the window as soon as you get into hospital, and the water birth did not happen for a number of different reasons.

Thus my advice is:
i) Focus on the post-natal bit rather than the birth and be very very very flexible with your birth plan and be realistic that it might not happen that way at all!
ii) If I had to do it again, I would pay for a private midwife . that is the only way you can have continuous care throughout your pregnancy and also the only way you 'might' end up having the birth that you would like.

Good luck and enjoy your pregnancy, and start reading about baby after she/ he is born and also about breastfeeding cause it helps a lot to know your stuff beforehand cause when the baby is around you will have no time to read!

[AKA]

I had my son at George's and it was fine. I actually found the after care pretty good too. Although I think I'm in the minority. To be honest I think it's best to have no expectations and then everything is easier to deal with. Plans fly out the window! I know it's hard to do this, as it's so unknown, but it's good to focus beyond the birth. I felt very prepped for a natural birth that didn't happen (and felt no disappointment about that) and wasn't really prepared for actually dealing with a new born baby.