CROSSRAIL 2 VENTILATION SHAFT (AGAIN)

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Broken Dad
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Re: CROSSRAIL 2 VENTILATION SHAFT (AGAIN)

Postby Broken Dad » Sun Nov 15, 2015 10:15 pm

Balham is very well served by rail and tube and beautiful to boot. We do not want it ruined for years on end by construction. This will at the very least:

1. Lower house prices for many during the very lengthy build and I am talking serious % NOT 5%;

2. Make any house near it almost valueless (to the owner by killing its equity) and almost permanently unsalable; and

3. Destroy shopping, nightlife and ambience in Balham (according the plans).

But hey at least commuters from miles out of London and in adjacent places such as Battersea (where many voting in favour of Balham seem to come from) may benefit. Selfish I know but why would we in Balham want to ruin ourselves economically for some unknown commuter?
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pie81
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Re: CROSSRAIL 2 VENTILATION SHAFT (AGAIN)

Postby pie81 » Sun Nov 15, 2015 11:39 pm

Please, everyone, take a look at the blog Boobelle linked to (no it's not my blog).

It points out that if Balham or Tooting is on the crossrail 2 route, overcrowding on the northern line may well get worse not better.

To sum up what the blogger says:

Anyone coming from this area (or further out) who currently takes a Northern line tube and is headed to the City is not going to change onto Crossrail, because the northern line is quicker

But people commuting to the City coming from the new outlying Crossrail stations WILL try to change onto the northern line at Balham/tooting, again because the northern line would be quicker to the city than changing at tottenham court road. So actually a crossrail link here will bring a lot MORE traffic to this part of the northern line!

The only people who might switch from northern line to Crossrail, thus reducing northern line congestion, are those going to Victoria/west end. BUT there aren't nearly so many people headed that way, and those people are already served by trains from Balham, Wandsworth Common, Clapham Junction.

Basically the claim of Crossrail reducing northern line crush doesn't make any sense if you recognise that most of that crush is headed to the City.
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Broken Dad
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Re: CROSSRAIL 2 VENTILATION SHAFT (AGAIN)

Postby Broken Dad » Mon Nov 16, 2015 8:51 am

excellent point and well made.

crossrail is a disaster for Balham
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actuallyadad
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Re: CROSSRAIL 2 VENTILATION SHAFT (AGAIN)

Postby actuallyadad » Mon Nov 16, 2015 3:19 pm

You've got it the wrong way round. Better transport connections make places BETTER and property values HIGHER! Not the other way around!

A few short years of disruption will be worth long term improvement.

Think long-term and bigger picture people! Narrow minded, short sighted nimby views was NOT what built London!
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Broken Dad
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Re: CROSSRAIL 2 VENTILATION SHAFT (AGAIN)

Postby Broken Dad » Mon Nov 16, 2015 3:28 pm

Please do not call me narrow minded. i do not think that i am. Can you stop the personal attacks please and can we discuss this nicely. Those are I am finding the rules on this site.

1. Someone has noted that Crossrail will make the Northern line more crowded. People will come in from outside London and change onto the Northern Line at Balham increasing congestion.

2. The build will be awful and very long and beyond merely inconvenient;

3. It will not increase prices in places such as Balham but it will do so at the end of the line not at the stations that are already very well served e.g. Balham. There is lots of evidence for this; and

4. There is nothing wrong with not wanting your house made unsalable, your equity destroyed, fighting your own corner etc etc. If you think that we all have to ruin our lives for the good of the nation then count me out. The nation is made of individuals and your type of thought is the dogma of nasty regimes from the last century.

Long live Balham and sod Crossrail.
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Annabel (admin)
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Re: CROSSRAIL 2 VENTILATION SHAFT (AGAIN)

Postby Annabel (admin) » Mon Nov 16, 2015 4:40 pm

Hi Dads

:-)

Please do keep the conversations polite!

Totally understand we'll have differences of opinions but lets keep it friendly.

Thanks all for using NVN!

:-)
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Honeybee2010
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Re: CROSSRAIL 2 VENTILATION SHAFT (AGAIN)

Postby Honeybee2010 » Tue Nov 17, 2015 9:39 am

For anyone who would like to voice an opinion and hopefully try to stop the destruction of Wandsworth Common please attend the meeting with TfL next Monday 23rd Nov at Wandsworth Town Hall.

PLEASE EMAIL YOUR ATTENDANCE SO THEY KNOW HOW MANY ARE GOING, SIMPLY, "I WILL ATTEND THE MEETING ON / AT…" ; crossrail2@tfl.gov.uk

Date: Monday 23 November
Time: 6:30 – 7:30 pm
Venue: Wandsworth Civic Suite, The Town Hall, Wandsworth High Street, London, SW18 2PU

*** Please also take time to register your opposition to the destruction of the common on the following petition :

https://consultations.tfl.gov.uk/crossrail/2
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sammyR
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Re: CROSSRAIL 2 VENTILATION SHAFT (AGAIN)

Postby sammyR » Wed Nov 18, 2015 8:22 pm

A local campaign has begun in earnest to oppose the CR2 proposal for a ventilation shaft on Wandsworth Common, this time on a new routing through Balham.

We have a Facebook page already set up , and our website is due to go live very shortly. This weekend will hopefully see a huge flyer distribution in the area , along with a paper petition to supplement our online e-petition.

We urge anyone who loves this common as much as we do , to do the following:

1. Tell TFL exactly what you think of their plans on CR2 Consultation pages - CHOOSE the BALHAM section
https://consultations.tfl.gov.uk/crossr ... nsultation
2. Like our FB page - https://www.facebook.com/SaveWandsworth ... rossrail2/
3. Sign our petition
http://democracy.wandsworth.gov.uk/mgEP ... ID=7814164

Please SPREAD the word... we cannot let this happen to Wandsworth Common
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Broken Dad
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Re: CROSSRAIL 2 VENTILATION SHAFT (AGAIN)

Postby Broken Dad » Wed Nov 18, 2015 8:29 pm

Hi

May I ask if this is a campaign limited solely to W common or to avoid the Balham route altogether please? I ask because if the latter then I would find it altogether more attractive. Good luck in any event.

Thanks
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ukrailblog
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Re: CROSSRAIL 2 VENTILATION SHAFT (AGAIN)

Postby ukrailblog » Wed Nov 18, 2015 10:31 pm

As I noted on the Wandsworth Common website, those who oppose the shaft only have two choices:

1) Find a different shaft location on the route between Balham and Clapham Junction (because a shaft is considered to be a safety requirement, and not optional)

2) Argue for a different route - Tooting Broadway or Earlsfield

Note that the Tooting Broadway route would also have a shaft in the Wandsworth Common area (see factsheets 12 and 12b on the consultation website). An Earlsfield routing would go nowhere near the common and so need no shaft there.
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Goldhawk
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Re: CROSSRAIL 2 VENTILATION SHAFT (AGAIN)

Postby Goldhawk » Wed Nov 18, 2015 10:48 pm

Please point out exactly where it says where the shafts would be for the Tooting route because I can't see it
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ukrailblog
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Re: CROSSRAIL 2 VENTILATION SHAFT (AGAIN)

Postby ukrailblog » Wed Nov 18, 2015 10:56 pm

It does not say where (as TfL is backing Balham). But look for the small black circles on the proposed route map. (Factsheet s12, last page). The one on the Tooting to Clapham Junction route (dashed line) is shown to be slightly to the west of that on the Balham to Clapham Junction line (solid line).
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ukrailblog
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Re: CROSSRAIL 2 VENTILATION SHAFT (AGAIN)

Postby ukrailblog » Fri Nov 20, 2015 8:50 am

I asked TfL at a consultation event as to where the shaft would be on the Tooting to Clapham Junction route. They don't know exactly, because they are not actively investigating it. However, they indicated that previous high level investigations had looked at a site on a "quiet road" by the prison and not the common. My guess (and its only a guess) would be the garden centre on Heathfield Road).
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hilaryvn47@gmail.com
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Re: CROSSRAIL 2 VENTILATION SHAFT (AGAIN)

Postby hilaryvn47@gmail.com » Mon Nov 23, 2015 10:31 am

I am not against CrossRail 2. I think its a very short sighted porposal
Looking at the confusion on this website I am appalled at the lack of informed debate and I lay the blame totally on CrossRails disgusting failure to formally inform residents of the area of the proposals, and their reticence and producing detailed information about why they are rejecting Tooting.

The position of the Shaft is to be at the end of Honeywell Road on the Common to the right by and behind the duckpond. The construction site is going to be large perhaps 2/3 of a football pitch. The shaft :20-30m deep and 25x25m in size min and 5-10 yeqrs to build, requiring the removal of 12500-18750 cubic meters of soil, rock etc. An 8yard skip = 6-08cu m of heavy waste. Removal journeys only 2055-3083 journeys of heavy lorries on an already gridlocked road, not counting the amount of material that will need to be imported ..scaffolding, bricks etc...
Balham Station will require more changeovers than Tooting, it is situated by a large secondary school, and 2 primary schools. Balham will lose Waitrose and its library. The Garden Centre loss might be sad, if the prison site is used, but its part of a chain and could be relocated. There may be no need to lose it.
CrossRail's proposals duplicate the existing transport and add commuters. Tooting and other South London residents would like to be able to travel quickly and comfortably from East to West, as well as Central London. which would open up access and create more 'centres' of employment, Tooting itself Hammersmith .. the A4 corridor ? Heathrow? Swirl analysis says it probably create more problems than it solves. Many journeys into Central London are only required to change trains. The proposed Chelsea station is a waste of space,it connects to bus routes and a slow moving street, Victoria station is already dangerously overpopulated during rush hours, why add to it? I have seen no evidence of a survey that actually asks people where they want to go and what would benefit their lives in terms of transport.

Estate agents I have spoken to think that houses will be blighted for the duration of the works. As a grandparent/pensioner I might not see the other side of this debacle, I don't see it being good for the future of South London.

please read more savewandsworthcommonagain.com then sign the petition

https://democracy.wandsworth.gov.uk/mge ... splay.aspx

2) Complete the TfL Crossrail 2 questionnaire -
https://consultations.tfl.gov.uk/crossr ... nsultation
Balham and Wandsworth
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HightreesHouse
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Re: CROSSRAIL 2 VENTILATION SHAFT (AGAIN)

Postby HightreesHouse » Mon Nov 23, 2015 11:19 am

Having attended a CR2 consultation meeting. Building at Tooting Broadway would cost £500million more that building in Balham due to water table. The design brief is to go through a Northern Line station therefore Earlsfield cuts no dice.

To build in Tooting requires a much larger site including residential house take (!) and to truck all spoil out of Tooting overland rather than underground back down tunnel route as with Balham. It will also take 2 years longer. The implications for businesses and residents in Tooting are horrendous. House prices would be the least of it!

If the Balham route is chosen, the emergency access shaft on Wandsworth Common is the only option as the other is residential house take. THis is because the curve is so steep from Balham to Clapham Junction that there is no flexibility to adjust the route.

An emergency access shaft takes two years to construct and is unobstrusively landscaped afterwards. A great many pictures being touted about show a station being built at Tottenham Court Rd. Not the same thing at all.
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