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March against Brexit to Parliament Square - 23rd June 2018 - date for your diaries!

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GuyD73
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March against Brexit to Parliament Square - 23rd June 2018 - date for your diaries!

Postby GuyD73 » Thu Dec 14, 2017 2:14 pm

This is 6 months away but if you're a passionate 'remainer' then you might want to save the date.

I think it's incredibly important that those who strongly believe that our children's future will be brighter with the UK as a member of the EU, actually turn up to events like this and make their voices heard.

We have been to both the recent London marches and they were cheerful, optimistic and very safe, with lots of families. Order your flags and t-shirts now and come armed with drums, whistles, horns etc.

You can invite your friends using the Britain for Europe event page here https://www.facebook.com/events/1656093264453668/

Is anyone else delighted at the tory rebellion which meant the government lost the vote on the amendment for a meaningful vote? I'm really pleased but also non-plussed at how David Davis' repeated lying to Parliament, the select committee or the public isn't considered contempt, remarkable he is still a minister.

Brexit is by no means a done deal. I think the alledged electoral fraud by vote leave, dark money and Russian influence render the result entirely illegitimate, so I will continue fighting to stop it for the sake of my kids. That's before you consider the unprecedented lying and the £350m for the NHS. The NHS will get LESS money after Brexit rather than more, and independent commentators are all saying we'll be poorer whatever kind of Brexit is pursued - not sure how many people voted to be poorer. It pains me my kids will not have the same freedoms I've had to live and work in 27 other countries.

If you're wealthy, then please consider supporting Jolyon Maughan QC's judicial review on Vote leave electoral fraud https://www.crowdjustice.com/case/did-v ... ng-limits/

Keep fighting folks. It's beyond belief that we have a house of commons where the vast majority of MPs believe Brexit will be damaging to the UK for years to come but are still voting it through due to some misplaced idea that 52/48 split in an advisory (and deeply flawed) referendum was somehow the immutable will of the people. Happily there are a few among our elected representatives who don't see it that way. Resist!
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atbattersea
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Re: March against Brexit to Parliament Square - 23rd June 2018 - date for your diaries!

Postby atbattersea » Thu Dec 14, 2017 2:54 pm

GuyD73 wrote:...dark money and Russian influence...
While I'm on your side, I don't really think it matters very much who told the lies - people were gullible enough, or disaffected enough, to believe them.

I don't think you'll change many people's minds, they didn't vote on the facts, they just voted to give the 'establishment' a kick in the nuts. It doesn't matter to them that they are also harming themselves.
the parsley song
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Re: March against Brexit to Parliament Square - 23rd June 2018 - date for your diaries!

Postby the parsley song » Thu Dec 14, 2017 6:19 pm

Oh for effs sake Guy, it's happening, get over it, get a life and less photos of your bereft family please :oops: .
B&BsMum
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Re: March against Brexit to Parliament Square - 23rd June 2018 - date for your diaries!

Postby B&BsMum » Fri Dec 15, 2017 5:24 am

Jeez The Parsley Song, what's your problem? If you don't agree with someone's comments, respond with a reasoned argument or just let it go. Your response was rude and unnecessary. In case you didn't get the memo, there's an unspoken code here on NVN that we don't lower ourselves to ranting at fellow posters just for the sake of it. If you don't like that approach, jog on...
the parsley song
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Re: March against Brexit to Parliament Square - 23rd June 2018 - date for your diaries!

Postby the parsley song » Fri Dec 15, 2017 6:04 pm

Yep, point taken but I'm just so sick of his page-long rants. It's been going on for MONTHS. More for his sanity than mine, he needs to move on with his life, business and family and stop using NVN as his personal soapbox.
lalectrice
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Re: March against Brexit to Parliament Square - 23rd June 2018 - date for your diaries!

Postby lalectrice » Fri Dec 15, 2017 7:41 pm

Well don't read them then, theparsleysong! Guy, please do keep posting and informing us of the important struggle to reinstate national common sense and end the disaster that is Brexit.
windmill26
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Re: March against Brexit to Parliament Square - 23rd June 2018 - date for your diaries!

Postby windmill26 » Fri Dec 15, 2017 8:29 pm

the parsley song wrote:Yep, point taken but I'm just so sick of his page-long rants. It's been going on for MONTHS. More for his sanity than mine, he needs to move on with his life, business and family and stop using NVN as his personal soapbox.
It is not compulsory to read posts or reply to them.Guy has every right to post on Nappyvalley and I wouldn't worry about his sanity either!
the parsley song
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Re: March against Brexit to Parliament Square - 23rd June 2018 - date for your diaries!

Postby the parsley song » Sat Dec 16, 2017 5:10 pm

I'd love to not read them, but if you on NVN then you get "Guy Dorrell's very loud anti-Brexit speakers corner" unfortunately. Guy - you can get at box at Speakers Corner in Hyde Park if you want to rant about your politics.
windmill26
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Re: March against Brexit to Parliament Square - 23rd June 2018 - date for your diaries!

Postby windmill26 » Sat Dec 16, 2017 5:32 pm

the parsley song wrote:I'd love to not read them, but if you on NVN then you get "Guy Dorrell's very loud anti-Brexit speakers corner" unfortunately. Guy - you can get at box at Speakers Corner in Hyde Park if you want to rant about your politics.
You don't have to read posts you don't like or you are not interested in at all.You have to physically click on the post title to be able to read it...I think you just like to "stir the pot"! You are obviously a brexiter and you don't like what people like Guy do or say to try to make Brexit less of a disaster!
GuyD73
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Re: March against Brexit to Parliament Square - 23rd June 2018 - date for your diaries!

Postby GuyD73 » Mon Dec 18, 2017 10:51 am

Morning all. Thanks to everyone who made sensible and constructive comments, I’ll reply in order.

You’re probably right AtBattersea, perhaps it doesn’t much matter who told the lies but it will be interesting to see what happens with the investigations into Leave campaign funding and Russian influence don’t you think?

I also partially agree that it’s a combination of people who have succumbed to the relentless anti-EU propaganda in the right wing press over the years and believed the lies and those just wanting to give the government a bloody nose, because, as you say, many feel left behind. However, I think it’s also important to realise that that there are many who perhaps aren’t particularly well informed on the issues and were entirely persuaded to vote leave by the £350m on the side of the bus con. Notwithstanding the fact the number itself is bogus, it’s easy to see why that was such an effective tactic, indeed the very architects of the campaign have credited it with being the reason they won, and they’ve admitted to it being a lie.

I completely agree that it’ll be very difficult to persuade people to change their minds, but I’m not sure it’s a case of persuasion necessarily being required. The xenophobic, Brexit-at-any-cost, ‘we knew what we were voting for’ mob who can’t spell will never be persuaded it’s a bad idea, even in the face of incontrovertible evidence, so there’s no point wasting time with them. However, I think they are a relatively small proportion of leave voters and many, who simply wanted the NHS to get lots more money, seem to be changing their minds now they know it’s simply not true, they won’t get what they voted for and it’ll make them poorer.

There’s probably a natural tendency in human psychology to find it difficult to admit that one’s been duped, a slight feeling of shame I suppose that we’ve been had, so I reckon the challenge is now for remainers to propagate the narrative that no-one should be feeling shame about being lied to, and that there’s absolutely no shame in changing one’s mind when the facts change.

I am going to try and find some in the above category of leave voters and interview them, perhaps for a radio documentary or a comment piece in the local newspaper, so if this applies to you, then please get in touch.

Anyway, there are many reasons for passionate remainers to be cheerful. The Commons vote last week is very important and the fact the government lost will embolden rebels on other parts of the bill. Maybot has realised that she was also going to lose the vote on enshrining the date of departure in the bill, so has completely backed off, another fail for tory brexiteers.
Almost as good though is the latest poll which shows Remain with a ten point lead, which is a significant shift. Many politicians of various hues have always said that they’re open to a vote on the deal if there’s a meaningful change in public opinion, so we just need to keep it moving in that direction.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/po ... 14406.html

Don’t give up the fight everyone, it is very much all still to play for….
 
Chimera
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Re: March against Brexit to Parliament Square - 23rd June 2018 - date for your diaries!

Postby Chimera » Mon Dec 18, 2017 11:27 am

Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
GuyD73
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Re: March against Brexit to Parliament Square - 23rd June 2018 - date for your diaries!

Postby GuyD73 » Wed Dec 20, 2017 1:24 pm

Thanks so much B&BsMum, lalectrice and windmill26, really appreciate your comments. It’s not quite clear why Parsleysong is incapable of following the advice she’s been given by numerous members on this site to scroll on if she has nothing to contribute to posts, but it is rather tedious.

I suppose this is the level of erudition we’ve come to expect, given the Brexiteer refrain has gone from ‘You lost, get over it’ to the equally charming and enlightening ‘it’s happening, shut up and don’t question it’.

Well Parsleysong, let’s not pretend that this is anything other than your opinion. There are quite a few other people, arguably with more gravitas and significance than you, who think it’s far from a done deal. Tony Blair for example, and whatever you think of him, he’s certainly not stupid.
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... ver-europe

So Parsleysong, we’ve had the debate about whether this forum is an appropriate place for debate about Brexit and this community, as well as admin, conclusively decided IT WAS, so please stop your bleating. I’m also not simply putting forward my opinions on Brexit, I’m alerting the community to the fact there is another march (AN EVENT YES?) and it’s not unreasonable to think a few in our neighbourhood might like to go, given the way Wandsworth/Battersea and SW London in general, voted in the EU ref.

Whenever I find myself getting a bit cross with your narky jibes, I do reflect on how awful it must be to be you and my overriding emotion becomes sympathy. You seem to have so much hatred and bile inside you and it must be dreadful carrying it around everywhere. I’ve seen you turn a number of threads on here toxic with your unpleasantness and you generally detract from what is, for the most part, a supportive & collaborative forum.

So I will continue to post pictures of my beautiful young family where appropriate and will continue to fight the immense self-harming stupidity that is Brexit with every tool in my possession. I love my life, enjoy my business enormously and adore my partner and little girls, so your concern is touching but I would look to your own mental health first frankly. There’s another lovely picture of my ‘bereft’ family at the bottom for you, gosh they do look ‘bereft’ don’t they??? :D :D :D

So it’s fantastic to see a few others on this site who both share my views on Brexit and have also slapped you down and put you firmly back in your box in this thread. I couldn’t agree with B&BsMum more, time to JOG ON if you can’t help unprovoked attacks on people.

Oh and what do we make of the mysterious Chimera, who’s only posted on NVN twice, both on my Brexit posts. I wonder if admin traced the IP address who it would lead us too…?
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TootSweep
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Re: March against Brexit to Parliament Square - 23rd June 2018 - date for your diaries!

Postby TootSweep » Wed Dec 20, 2017 4:50 pm

Keep it up Guy - it's not over till it's over. Keep marching, posting, Tweeting & signing petitions to stop this madness!
the parsley song
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Re: March against Brexit to Parliament Square - 23rd June 2018 - date for your diaries!

Postby the parsley song » Wed Dec 20, 2017 6:18 pm

I'm not going to click on a link to find out what Tony Blair thinks. The Guardian ffs :shock: - known for its very balanced opinions! It's as bad as the Daily Mail.

Last time I checked, it is not a criminal offence to have voted to get out, despite the way you are reacting. The red-tape, the dodgy ECJ rulings that mean we can't send terrorists and other undesirables back home (after British courts have said it is), the massive over-pressure on housing, schools, NHS, getting an appointment at the GP... The fact that the UK is a huge net-payer-in to the EU coffers and in theory since Tony Blair opened the borders we are free to live in Slovakia, Greece, Germany, Romania and vis-a-versa. But that hasn't been the reality - it's been one-way mostly and we can't afford it.

You seem to have a really sneery and incredibly arrogant notion in your head of why people like me voted out - less happy/intelligent/educated than you. Not true. Since you brought it up, if you want to compare my happiness, the happiness of my kids, my qualifications, experience and intelligence, you can PM me anytime you like. I've met you and can grant you that.

You know what, if you actually get out of the London bubble to Yorkshire, Norfolk wherever and start talking to people (like I do) you will find it really interesting and it will challenge you ideas (always a good thing!). They are not less happy/educated/intelligent than you - not by a long shot.

I realise that I'm in the minority in London but I've never minded going against the "bully" opinion, but just remember, if you take London out of the equation then the vast majority of the UK voted to leave.
Denwand
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Re: March against Brexit to Parliament Square - 23rd June 2018 - date for your diaries!

Postby Denwand » Thu Dec 21, 2017 7:53 am

Any chance of a "Christmas Truce" on this subject?

Posting notice of a coming march or event for one side or the other is fair enough but as we all know, such threads generate much heat but zero light.

Ad hominem attacks, bitter sniping , mass generalisations etc look like silly playground mud slinging when you step away from it - and anyone who is convinced of a particular argument by an internet forum thread frankly doesn't deserve a vote in the first place!

Alienation, frustration, anger, bitterness and resolve of your original position is the only result.
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