Lack of state school places

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Computersaysno
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Lack of state school places

Postby Computersaysno » Thu Aug 29, 2024 5:48 pm

I'm working with a journalist planning to write a story about the lack of spaces in state schools, in the context of private school parents trying to move their kids to state schools following the recent VAT on private schools announcement. They are trying to highlight the lack of spaces (I know this is very true for Battersea secondaries with people being told there is absolutely nothing available), people being offered spaces in schools which are miles away, and people who haven't been able to contact the council or speak to anyone due to summer holidays. Please PM me if you could help, in total confidence of course. Thanks!
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onthecommon
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Re: Lack of state school places

Postby onthecommon » Thu Aug 29, 2024 6:44 pm

Stirring of the greatest order.
The VAT change does not happen till January and no evidence (yet) that people are leaving any of the in demand Private Secondaries.

A non story with no evidence. There is a process for applying to state schools which was last autumn - primary and secondary.  
Do your homework, get some real evidence and come back with actual evidence that there is a greater demand due specifically to this change (which hasn’t happened yet).

Assume article is for Daily Fail or Telegraph where facts don’t matter anymore - just noise and attempts to divide communities.  
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Starr
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Re: Lack of state school places

Postby Starr » Thu Aug 29, 2024 9:23 pm

Just simply untrue. In fact, the popular state secondaries in my area: Graveney selective, Chestnut Grove Academy and Bollingbroke Academy have been easier than ever to secure a place due to less children of that age needing a school place. The same even goes for once extremely tight catchment areas for popular primary schools.
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Threedragons
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Re: Lack of state school places

Postby Threedragons » Thu Aug 29, 2024 9:28 pm

What an awful response.... I know people whose life has been thrown in disarray by this announcement. The poster is not stirring and just asking for people who want to share experiences. You don't wait until January to move your child, you try to do it in September? Not mid year
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Threedragons
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Re: Lack of state school places

Postby Threedragons » Thu Aug 29, 2024 9:29 pm

What an awful response.... I know people whose life has been thrown in disarray by this announcement. The poster is not stirring and just asking for people who want to share experiences. You don't wait until January to move your child, you try to do it in September? Not mid year
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Funandgamesandall
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Re: Lack of state school places

Postby Funandgamesandall » Thu Aug 29, 2024 10:20 pm

I don't know where you take your information from @onthecommon And *starr but a friend of mine has been trying to get a place for her child going into year 10 since May and has been told that there are NO places In the entire Battersea. Zero. Null. I've seen the email with my own eyes. There are places in n primary schools perhaps but nothing in secondaries so, unless you are stirring yourself, I don't know where you take your information from because I've seen the response she had from the council with my own eyes. OP - I will get her to message you
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onthecommon
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Re: Lack of state school places

Postby onthecommon » Thu Aug 29, 2024 10:52 pm

The point is that the difficulty to get into popular State Secondaries or Primaries has nothing to do with a potential increase in some private fees next January.  

If the journalist is serious and cared about education maybe an investigation into real terms reduction in funding of all state schools would be a better use of time.  Otherwise it looks like another piece which certain newspapers have been running trying to blame unrelated problems in education on this new policy eg Telegraph and Fail blaming closure of already failing private schools on this policy.

Where were the stories around the private fees going up over the last 5 years and impact on State Schools ?

The private schools do not have to pass the VAT increase onto fees - they could reduce some services, make less profit, reduce their staffing, less expensive overseas trips, tighten their belts - in the same way all State schools have had to do over the last 14 years +
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Starr
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Re: Lack of state school places

Postby Starr » Fri Aug 30, 2024 8:42 am

https://www.theguardian.com/education/2024/mar/01/london-secondary-school-applications-down-by-4000-after-fall-in-birthrate

It is a demographic trend that the number of children in the capital is dropping. We have talked about the factors on Nappy Valley before.


" I know people whose life has been thrown in disarray by this announcement."

Yes and So do I. It is a bad situation for many have 20 percent added to already hefty fees which is what the argument needs to focus on. I know a few who will have send younger children to state secondary while elder one is at an independent as they just cannot afford to send all or both know. I know 1 family who've moved their child into state secondary in year 9 because thwy just cannot continue with the costs.

Also Secondary places at London Independent schools continue to be in demand and people are willing to pay fees in order to get it. More and more children are prepped at state primary schools in order to sit entrance exams for this places.

There needs to be an honest discussion about the families these fees will outprice and put under enormous strain and cause disruption to children who will have no choice but to leave.
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Computersaysno
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Re: Lack of state school places

Postby Computersaysno » Fri Aug 30, 2024 8:52 am

Thank you for a more balanced response Starr. Onthecommon seems to be totally blinded by some hatred of these schools. (By the way "expensive international trips" are never covered by the fees, many other things are not covered either, and no, it's not for The Telegraph of Daily Mail if you need to know).

I didn't mean to create this conversation and needed a couple of PMs from affected people which I now got. Thank you. There are a few stories to be told here. So let's consider the thread closed
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Starr
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Re: Lack of state school places

Postby Starr » Fri Aug 30, 2024 10:00 am

My apologies if you meant lack of school places for people who can no longer afford the fees for their child/ child and siblings. Because this may well be the case in the upper years but not sp for thoseooking to enter at year 7.
I really hope the journalist focuses on more normal British families who will be outpriced or struggle. Also those with neurodiverse children who are better suited to independent schools . The number of super wealthy and/ or international families in presitigous independent schools has increased over the past 2 decades ans they are very present in London. The VAT fees will not hurt them one bit.
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Computersaysno
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Re: Lack of state school places

Postby Computersaysno » Fri Aug 30, 2024 10:09 am

Yes, this is exactly the focus :-) and including neurodiverse children too.

It's the secondary schools availability in Wandsworth, after year 7 entry. Some families have been told to look at schools as far as Essex and Kent... There is nothing for years 9 / 10 etc... and the kids can't continue with the same GCSEs or A levels they started as they are not offered in some schools or relevant classes are already full. It's a big problem locally as, while Wandsworth is well off and many people paid the private fees, it's not Chelsea or Mayfair and some people have now been pushed over the edge. The really rich ones have probably prepaid everything so it's the ones who were working hard to find money for the fees every quarter that are really affected...
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Dud1ey
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Re: Lack of state school places

Postby Dud1ey » Fri Aug 30, 2024 10:20 am

I’d really love to see the impact on SEN covered as that’s a real issue. As the above poster says, neurodiverse children often do not suit the usual set-up of a state secondary - very large intake, very little personalised pastoral care, even where there are TAs/LSAs they are usually dedicated to the children with the most severe behavioural issues (which of course makes sense). The noise and size of the schools can be overwhelming and distressing for an autistic child for example.

Not all autistic children manage to get EHCPs. It takes years and due to lack of funding they are much harder to get than a few years ago. So many parents who have decided to make sacrifices for their SEN children are being whacked with an additional fee increase because the EHCP exemption for the VAT on school fees is very narrow.

Now I appreciate that even being able to consider funding for independent schools for SEN is a privilege. And I also appreciate that the VAT has been on the cards for a while. But the way it was discussed pre election was that SEN would be protected. And they are not for a large number of people. The SEN friendly (not special schools, but smaller more nurturing schools that are more welcoming of SEN) are often not the larger more established schools that charge high fees and have expensive facilities. Many of us would have budgeted on that basis. I hope the journalist can focus on this issue instead. In my case I would have preferred to send my child to a state school like my other children, but the options presented to us did not inspire us with confidence that the SEN would be adequately catered for.
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Computersaysno
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Re: Lack of state school places

Postby Computersaysno » Fri Aug 30, 2024 10:44 am

Yes, I have two children with SEN who attend private for the same reasons. They couldn't cope in busy state senior schools. This is why I'm involved in this and this is why it really hurts me to see the blind hatred some people demonstrate, not understanding how different these schools and these children can be. These are also the parents who kill themselves to pay for the fees (us), not because they want posh schools or networking or nice uniforms but because we feel we have no choice. Seeing our children fail and suffer from mental health is not the choice I want to be forced to make
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Starr
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Re: Lack of state school places

Postby Starr » Fri Aug 30, 2024 10:58 am

I'm really glad this thread hasn't been closed.
I really hated the thread a few months ago encouraging local families from the private schools to take places in state schools with no intention to take them to throw the councils into disarray. Important these people do not hijack the issues given how highly emotive state vs private debates are.
It's important to make an argument for those who will suffer as a result of the 20 per cent increse. Absolutely agree the situation for SEND and mental health in general is in dire straits and mainsteam schools cannot cope which is awful for the children.
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