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Re: TOTALLY SHOCKED AT SUCH IGNORANT PEOPLE

by Scottov » Mon Apr 15, 2013 9:04 pm

dancing_queen59 wrote: .
Irrelevant of how a parent deals with it the diners are still totally out of order and especially living in an area with so many under 5's should of just stayed out of it
That's going too far

Re: TOTALLY SHOCKED AT SUCH IGNORANT PEOPLE

by daddy72 » Mon Apr 15, 2013 3:11 pm

@ Dancing Queen - It seems that you were trying to address the tantrum, that's all we parents can do. If you were sat there doing nothing then perhaps that would be an issue - unfortunately there are parents who do that. In no way should you feel that you can't take kids out anywhere.

Re: TOTALLY SHOCKED AT SUCH IGNORANT PEOPLE

by dancing_queen59 » Mon Apr 15, 2013 2:59 pm

Apologies for making a comment so late! Ive been reading through some of thr comments and I just wanted to add a bit more to what happened.

The whole tantrum started off because he wanted a second biscuit. I was about to tell him he could after he had his dinner but as soon as I said no it all kicked off. Trying to talk to a very loud shouting toddler is impossible. I was simply allowing a break in his loudness to communicate. Giving him the biscuit to 'shut him up' like the diners would of liked was not what was going to happen! I just wanted to add that with me I had an

other under 5 and a 4 week old baby. Trying to drag outside an extremely heavy toddler and leaving 2 children there was sadly not option although this is what I would of done if I wasnt alone.

Irrelevant of how a parent deals with it the diners are still totally out of order and especially living in an area with so many under 5's should of just stayed out of it

I have since seen that woman who smiled at me and did not receive the same response back!

This whole situatiin has made me very nervous about being out in a public place

Re: TOTALLY SHOCKED AT SUCH IGNORANT PEOPLE

by MGMidget » Mon Apr 15, 2013 2:37 pm

I also think its wrong to think the world revolves around their children and everyone else should put up with them nomatter what the behaviour. Of course we can't expect them to behave exactly like adults but if they are really disturbing others then we have to try and keep the behaviour within reasonable limits. I speak as someone who has a child not a 'suit'.

Re: TOTALLY SHOCKED AT SUCH IGNORANT PEOPLE

by daddy72 » Mon Apr 15, 2013 9:37 am

I was in a Costa a couple of weeks ago and my little one started playing up and got a little loud. As any parent would I'm trying to calm her down and it was taking sometime. While this was going on a suit at the table next to me turned and said "please keep it down I'm trying to conduct an interview here" :shock:

I turned to the interviewee and suggested she looked for a job at a company that didn't need to conduct interviews at a coffee shop on the high street. ;)

Unfortunately there are always going to be people that think children should be kept out of coffee shops, restaurants, planes etc. Usually sad people who think the world revolves around them.

Re: TOTALLY SHOCKED AT SUCH IGNORANT PEOPLE

by Scottov » Tue Apr 09, 2013 2:16 pm

mungomuffit wrote:Having read this thread with interest as it unfolded, I hadn't expected to be in a similar situation so soon! Blimey, it was terrible and I'm not sure I did the right thing (no doubt Scottov will tell me I didn't), just did what I thought was right at the time in a VERY challenging situation.

I arrived to meet my parents and 7 yo son at Chelsea Carluccios with a cold and grumpy 5 year old daughter (we got lost, it was snowing, probably walked nearly a mile to find it, so I understand that she was not in the best mood). My parents fuss over her: "where do you want to sit darling, here, there?" "Next to Nana" she says, but that's where her brother is sitting. No, sit here next to me, your brother is sitting there. Kew (sp?) whinging, carrying on. So brother moves into the spare seat next to me so she can have the seat next to Nana. She's still not happy. Now she decides she wants to sit next to me, where her brother has moved. I say no, your brother has moved to give you that seat and is not moving again, stop being a pain or we will go home. Meanwhile, my parents are fussing over her and giving me dark looks because I'm not backing down to my 5yo dictator. But, that's for another thread - grandparents who contradict parents openly in front of the children ...

Well, to cut a long story short, daughter was determined to be a little sh*t, disturbing people in the restaurant and ruining our lunch, so I gradually gathered our belongings, stuffed her into her coat, picked her up and carried her over my shoulder out the door. She then screamed her lungs out on Fulham Road and then for the next 5 minutes in the cab home, while I couldn't stop crying. [Cabbie was pretty happy because I gave him a large tip to make up for it!] She's really great most of the time, I hasten to add :?

I agree with Lulubear that the onus is on us if we take our children to a public place that they need learn to behave and with Ellesmum and Supergirl that it's never too young to set boundaries. Take the child home as a punishment for behaving badly. Then, when it's calmer, explain to them why they were taken home. Which is what I did and she seems to understand and has been lovely ever since!

phew, sorry for the long post!
could not agree more.

things such as common decency, manners, and consideration should not be negotiable.

taking responsibility for the situation, which you clearly have is all anyone can ever ask of you. what's more, its likely to have set a boundary that your daughter will understand if not approve of.

after all, what are the chances that she didn't know she was being a little bit naughty, seeing how far she could push mummy in front of the grandparents?

Re: TOTALLY SHOCKED AT SUCH IGNORANT PEOPLE

by MGMidget » Tue Apr 09, 2013 11:50 am

Mungomuffit, I think you handled it very well actually - well done! It sounds like it had the desired effect too if your daughter is now behaving so well!

Re: TOTALLY SHOCKED AT SUCH IGNORANT PEOPLE

by falconmum » Mon Apr 08, 2013 7:28 pm

Well done mungomuffit. U r right. the onus is on US as parents.

Re: TOTALLY SHOCKED AT SUCH IGNORANT PEOPLE

by izzye789 » Mon Apr 08, 2013 3:21 pm

well done back you all the way!!

Re: TOTALLY SHOCKED AT SUCH IGNORANT PEOPLE

by Scottov » Mon Apr 08, 2013 12:44 pm

sk1 wrote:Scottov- Did you ever think that this mum might have been totally distracted by the fact that she received really bad news at the doctors?
Who knows what was on her mind, you saw one little snapshot of their day.
She might have just been trying to get out without breaking down.
God knows I cry most times I go to the doctors!
she might have just been abducted by aliens too.

you can make excuses for absolutely anyone, on anything if you are so inclined.

Re: TOTALLY SHOCKED AT SUCH IGNORANT PEOPLE

by Sherlika » Mon Apr 08, 2013 10:41 am

I would be very careful about judging parents and their children who are 'out of control.' In this case, however, the mother is the one who was appalling and she should have tidied up together with the child. It would be a great opportunity to teach him that is not ok to mess magazines and that he would have to put them back.

I wonder why nobody asked this mother to organise this mess? I would have. I can usually read the body language of people and see they kick themselves with frustration, but fail to complain and take action. This is a typical British behaviour where it is though that complaining is inadequate. It is not.

On the other hand, and this has nothing to do with 'sausage', going back to children who are 'out of control,' I would be very careful. There are some children with hidden disabilities who are difficult to be taught anything. I have a brother and a child with autism and I am an expert in this situation. So, judge less and think first if the parents are out of order.

Re: TOTALLY SHOCKED AT SUCH IGNORANT PEOPLE

by metoo » Mon Apr 08, 2013 9:34 am

My son often played up in the GP waiting room - it's not a place you can just walk out. I once asked the receptionist to look out for my name and she told me if I left the building and missed the call I forfeited my appointment!
He didn't scream or anything but was defiant, wandering off or being noisy with the toys or wanting to go through doors where he wasn't allowed.
He also ignored consequences - and yes, we did carry them out, he just didn't give 2 hoots. He played up a couple of times in a coffee shop - trying to put sugar in his milk, keep opening the door and we left. Always with a heavy heart as it was punishing me and his older brother. A child psychologist told us not to do this as he was getting his own way - he was bored in the coffee shop and he wanted to remove us all from somewhere he didn't want to be. :? I tell you, when it's your child you can't win. Just as the lady who tapped her son's hand to other's disgust I've had my parenting skills judged but in the opposite way: I was told I should give him a good slap. I don't hit my kids and I don't take parenting advice from people in the queue of WHSmiths!
I suppose my main rule was that I never wanted his behaviour to impinge on others and try and keep him safe (from himself!).

Re: TOTALLY SHOCKED AT SUCH IGNORANT PEOPLE

by sk1 » Mon Apr 08, 2013 8:32 am

Scottov- Did you ever think that this mum might have been totally distracted by the fact that she received really bad news at the doctors?
Who knows what was on her mind, you saw one little snapshot of their day.
She might have just been trying to get out without breaking down.
God knows I cry most times I go to the doctors!

DancingQueen, even if your child had been really out of control, for other customers to make you feel bad is really awful.

Re: TOTALLY SHOCKED AT SUCH IGNORANT PEOPLE

by izzye789 » Fri Apr 05, 2013 2:36 pm

no it wasnt scottiv far to many upper class familys let there children rule them i know i.v worked with them for more than 20 years and listen to the way they speak to there children just last week i saw a 3 year old kept running from room to room bashing in to her pregnant mum of 9 months all she could say with a smily face is please dont do that darling you will hurt the baby so she just carried on doing it .they just seem to humble to there children and let them rule.odd way to disepline children i think. they all think its a game.

Re: TOTALLY SHOCKED AT SUCH IGNORANT PEOPLE

by Lulubear » Fri Apr 05, 2013 11:29 am

With regards to the OP, I think if we take our children to a public place the onus is on us to try your best to keep our children's behaviour within reasonable boundaries or take them outside for a time out and ultimately leave if that doesn't work. As a parent of a former toddler I know how hard it can be sometimes and yes, there's always the dilemma of whether you try to discipline in public and risk a tantrum or allow low level misbehaviour and disobedience to continue because its less disruptive than a tantrum! Cafe Nero is not as child-focused as, say, Its a Kids Thing or Bertie and Boo's Adventure Island where its perfectly acceptable for kids to shout and scream.

I have always regarded taking my son out to restaurants or cafes as a bit of mission requiring a bit of planning (e.g remembering to bring some form of entertainment to cater for moments of boredom) and constant effort whilst I'm there to keep the behaviour acceptable. It has got easier as he has got older but it was certainly very hard work when he was a toddler. I can certainly remember a few difficult times in doctors practices when the waiting time was long or restaurants when the service was slow!

Five minutes is a long time to listen to someone else's child having a tantrum in my opinion so I do sympathise with those in the cafe who found it difficult to put up with. Not sure I would have said as much as them as I don't like confrontation much but I would have probably been annoyed! I do also sympathise with you OP. Its a difficult situation but I think I probably would have taken the children outside until the tantrum was over and asked the staff not to remove our food/drinks as we would be back.

And, Scottov, yes the behaviour of the mum in the doctor's surgery was totally inconsiderate!

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