Baby sleep advice?!?! 3 month old can't self-soothe... Post Reply

[shaneleone]

thanks again to everyone who has taken the time to reply. We went to the GP yesterday, who does suspect reflux due to the amount he's spitting up (all day long really, and quite a lot sometimes). So we're trying some things for reflux, and we also have an appointment with an osteopath next week at the OCC.

Then we still have a list of things to try, so I really appreciate all the suggestions, including the white noise link, persisting with swaddling, tummy sleeping, or even going out to buy a hairdryer (afraid I don't own one!). And there's always a sleep coach, though the price is keeping that option as my very last resort.

I did have a question for Carol Mae - what do you recommend? Since you said osteopathy, CIO, and a dummy are all bad ideas.... Though my GP did think reflux was an issue given the amount and frequency he's spitting up, I'm curious what training method you advise?

[Carol Mae]

Hi Shaneleone
Happy to discuss a little bit more to help you over a pm.
Carol

[shaneleone]

I wish I didn't feel compelled to post again, or could post with good news, but it's just gone from very bad to worse.

We started Infacol and gaviscon two days ago, on the advice of our GP, but if anything it seems to making things more difficult for him - though maybe I just need to give it more time.

Yesterday, I was home all day on my own with the baby - and spent the entire day trying to get him to sleep. It took hours each time (often interrupted by huge spit ups, or explosive nappies) and then when he finally did go to sleep, he would wake about 15 minutes later every time. He slept 5 times throughout the day but for only 10-15 minutes each time.

By the end of the day, he was exhausted. So I tried to put him down before my toddler, but again, he woke up about 15 minutes later. He had a bath at 5:30 and I started trying to put him down around 6, then had to pass him off to my husband at 8 pm, and he finally got him down at 9 pm. Then he woke at 1 a.m. and was up most of the rest of the night in bed with me - kicking and kicking and arching his back. I used to be able to settle him by holding his hand, but the last two nights he will only settle if he is nursing. We're absolutely shattered, so I am really hoping the osteopath may be able to help, but next week feels like it's lightyears away right now...

[supergirl]

I ve been reading this post and i think as all have said, you can only do your best so dont beat yourself too much.
It is good you went to the GP and get your baby helped if it is reflux.

Just a couple of things you should have in mind before your visit to osteopath.

1. It can make them vomit. My 2nd child was 1 week late, they broke my waters because it felt she was stuck in the canal. When she was 3-4 weeks old i went to see a baby physio/osteopath at physio for all on webbs rd.
during the night (about an hour after i put her down to bed) she vomitted everything. I called the place and said that sometimes it happens. And it did again for the next 2 sessions. BUT it worked well after that. Apparently she twirled so much while being that she was completely twirled inside so she was finding it very hard to digest and be comfortable.

2. It can make them cry. Big time. A cry that as a mum i will never forget. A cry for help but you know you are doing the best thing for them. All you can do is talk so your child hear your voice and hold the hands (to stop them fidgetting). It is highly upsetting for YOU, your child will forget the moment he is back in your arms.
I am sure as they grow up there will be many more times where as a mum i ll be heartbroken because i cant take the pain away from my children (hope not though), but still v hard.

I sm only saying that so you are prepared, i dont mean to put you off.

Good luck. X

[Blissfulbabyexpert]

I'm a mum of 3 and work as a maternity nurse advising mums on feeding, sleep issues. I offer FREE email/twitter ( @blissfulbabyexp) advice.
I have fantastic checkable references.
My new book THE BLISSFUL BABY expert is receiving great Amazon and twitter blog reviews from mums to be and mums with babies.

It's available to download using the link below for only £1. If you have an iPad, iPhone or android phone you can download the kindle App from the App Store and then Amazon will send the book wirelessly to your kindle App.

The feeding and sleep chapter will help you a lot and I'm also happy to offer email support for any questions you may have.
I only charge clients if I have to physically come to their house for a consultation-I'm not in this job for the money..I just want to help mums in any way I can. The book enables me to do this on a larger scale. It is currently in the hands of various publishers and literary agents who I'm waiting to hear feedback from.

Thanks for reading this

http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B00B ... ttom_links

[Littleowlsmum]

Hello,
Just a thought, he might have a dairy allergy. My little owl (so called as she was a terrible sleeper until she was 14 months old) behaved in a similar way and it wasn't until she was 6 months that it was diagnosed. She was BF until 8 months and was getting the symptoms through my milk. And she had silent reflux. I pushed and pushed to see a doctor because I just didn't sense it was "right" and we saw a paediatrician at Kingston hospital who diagnosed it within seconds of arriving. Your little one is still very little so might be just that his tummy/gastro bits aren't developed enough but might be worth getting a referral. I feel so sorry for you, sleep deprivation is awful. Wish these babies came with an instruction manual, would be so much easier....

[Galwaymammy]

Hi,
My second baby was just like yours. Started having sleep issues and colic symptoms at 3 weeks and things just got worse and worse. After trying loads of different things (osteopathy, infacol etc.) I went to a consultant and it turned out he had silent reflux. We went through a long process trying to find out how to sort him out (which I can go into if you want to PM me) but eventually we tried medication. Ranitidine helped but seemed to stop working after about 2 weeks. In the end it was losec mups that worked. It reduces the amount of stomach acid he produced so he was still spitting up into his mouth but his stomach acid wasn't burning his throat anymore. It took about a month to really work (I guess his throat had to heal before the pain went away) but he was a different child after it. I would also highly, highly recommend the book "Colic Solved: The Essential Guide to Infant Reflux and the Care of Your Crying, Difficult-To- Soothe Baby ", it explained the condition really well and all the different options for treating it (because there are many and different things work for different babies). It's also a surprisingly easy read, especially given it had to be read by someone working on 5 broken hours sleep while jiggling a cranky baby in a sling. He didn't end up a dream sleeper in the end (too many bad habits from 5 months of pain I guess), but he went from waking every 15 minutes between 2 am and 6 am to waking about 3 times a night in 12 hours. Good luck with it, my heart goes out to you, it's a really tough time, especially with a toddler you have no energy to play it. Never ending guilt!! PM me if you want more info.

[Galwaymammy]

One of the most common food allergies/intolerance is dairy. You could try cutting all dairy from your diet for 2 weeks and see if he improves. It's quite hard to do because there are dairy by products like whey in lots of things like shop bought biscuits and cake (which I was snacking away on to keep the exhaustion at bay). I tried it but it made no difference at all but just doing something helped another 2 weeks go by! Just a small bit of hope always helps! Giving up dairy worked really well for a friend of mine but her problem wasn't babies not sleeping it was twins with really severe (bleeding) nappy rash. Fixed them in three days. But apparently it can also help "colicky" babies like your little 'un.

[emsken]

Ask GP for ranitidine... Gaviscon did nothing for my 2!

Also maybe a dairy problem. If breast feeding cut out all dairy and if bottle ask GP for aptimil Pepti ...

[BabyMagic]

Gosh, poor you, this is a tricky one, in that you have a toddler to keep asleep too!
My name is Sophie and I'm a trainee Doctor, an ex-nanny (15 years) and a Family Consultant (i.e. trouble shooter). I'm with you on the controlled crying, especially before the age of 1yr. the child mayt eventually learn to self-soothe but IMHO in a fairly traumatic way, and it breaks the trust a little bit..."I cry, no-one comes, am I alone?". It may work well for some families but I have never used it. It's a personal choice.
Without seeing your little one feed, it's pretty hard to establish whether or not reflux or silent reflux is an issue. I would be a wee bit questioning of any GP who diagnoses and prescribes for a little baby on the basis of patient history alone. It certainly would be frowned on in Paediatrics. Reflux is a nasty condition for wee ones (and adults!) but it is rather over-diagnosed. On sheer history alone...the fact that your baby can lie flat after a feed and not have a problem, would suggest it may not be a problem? Is there any postural stiffening, back arching or milk aversion-type behaviour yet?
I'm not going to give you any recommendations, because that would be rather unsafe practice not having seen you or your little one, but if your GP has tried meds and they don't help on compliance, before you move on to ranitidine or a proton pump inhibitor, ask him to check your baby's ears, or even better, have a skilled paediatrician check this. I've had the odd case where underdevelopped or chronically blocked eustachian tubes (the tube between ear and sinus cavities) are the culprit in the under 2s.
It could all be behavioural, that's where my sleep consultant hat would come on, but it's best to rule out anything medical or developmental before you start spending money on behavioural help.
If you want a quick chat (free) I finish ward duty at 5pm most days at the moment and am happy to talk. If you get to the point where you are considering sleep training, then my observation session can often sort easier issues out, or a few nights training may be all that is needed. I'm about 50% cheaper than most and offer a sliding scale of costs, so that I don't just end up helping families at one end of the socio-economic bracket only.
I know that this probably wasn't very helpful, so far, but the trainee Doctor in me is wary of giving specific advice without knowing more first hand, so feel free to give me a bell, if you'd like. I may only have half an hour or so free, but I'm happy to talk if it helps. 07787993156.
Happy sleeping,
Sophie.

[pigeonairre]

My daughter was exactly like this - and it was an exhausting time. I went to my sister's wedding on about 2 hours sleep - look like a zombie in all the pics!!

You poor things - it is very testing. My daughter is 2 1/2 now and is a brilliant toddler, so keep you resolve and things will swing the other way.

For me, I eventually found a few things that worked to soothe her. It took me forever to work out that she was light sensitive during the day and easily stimulated - she just could not wind herself back down again (i was very busy in my pregnancy, and always rushing about, maybe that didn't help things!). In the day, I carried her in a sling for most of the time, when it was nap time, I would cover her over with a wrap or something light and breathable, to block out the light a bit. That way, she could feel me close, bit still have a bit of dark (obviously we always made sure that her head was facing sideways so that she could breathe, and that there was a nice gap there for air!), and I would walk around like this, patting her and she would ususally drift off quite quickly. We then progressed onto the pram when she was bigger, and would always cover it over and block out the light. she always needed a bit of a wind down cry - but I do think there are many babies who are easily over stimulated and just need that cry to de stress themselves! She also slept much better on her tummy than her back, which is not something anyone can advise you to do, as it is not deemed the safest way to sleep, but for us it worked and I would turn her back onto her back after she had dropped off. This all sounds extreme - but it worked for us - we also tried osteopathy, but without results I'm afraid.

In the end, patience, trying lots of things however random, worked to get her into her own little sleep routine. I ignored everyone who said she would be too clingy from me holding her a lot - she let go of this in her own time and is now brilliant. She goes straight to bed at night and soothes herself to sleep after her bedtime story.

Stay strong - it will pass xxxxx

[katkin2]

A very tough time for you and your husband, especially with a toddler too! Can I ask if your baby is clingy when awake? My 9 month old has always been clingy from day 1. I had this image of me having visitors in the first couple of weeks after having my baby and us all cooing over her whilst she lay swaddled in a blanket and drifting in and out of sleep.

This was not the reality and she barnacled herself to me for a good few months! She was never calm and content on anything but a person and I had no choice but to carry her on me or she would just scream if put down, only sleeping when close. It is so hard, particularly when you have a bad back. I expected her to cry but not everytime I put her down and not for hours on end in the evening.

At night I slept with her on my chest for 2 months, again very hard as you get no personal space and after carrying them for 9 months this is a desperate need! For 2 more months she slept between me and my husband. There are lots of people who will tell you this is wrong but I doubt these people have ever been in a situation where there is no other choice! To be the best parent you can be you need to sleep. Research suggests children who co sleep with parents have been found to grow up feeling more secure. Some people will tell you the baby/child will be stuck there forever but for us this was not the case.

At 4 months there was a turning point and my daughter could be put in her Moses basket asleep or sleepy and not scream. From 4 months she slept in a cot in her own room. It took 6 months and weaning for her to sleep longer stints at night but this is common. Gradually she began to comfort herself with a bunny blanket and at about 7 months she used it to help her fall asleep. Although during the day I rock her to sleep with music as she cries if put in cot.


I do think my baby had colic and she was found to have a tongue tie, at 9 weeks old, which made it difficult for her to feed but I truly believe it is just her personality and what she needed. At 9 months my baby sleeps through most nights and my husband and I have our bed back (she is even missed by me sometimes

I was told by someone to hold her close, let her sleep on me if needed and she would feel secure enough one day to sleep independently. For me this was true and looking back I am so glad I gave her what she needed. She is still a clingy baby with a dislike for car seats and buggies. She is strong minded and definately not laid back. She is gorgeous though, very cuddly, active and very able.

Some people find controlled crying helps, if that is a route you want to take but I don't think it works for all babies and 6 months is the suggested minimum age. I know it is hard now but it will get easier. I just got through it by telling myself it would not last and it definately didn't good luck!

[Proudmumof2]

I am struggling with my 4 month old and his sleep pattern. I had no issues with my first child and thought it would be easier years later second time around. How very wrong I was.

[shaneleone]

Hello,

Just wanted to post an update - as my 3 month old is now 9 months! We eventually got a referral for an allergy clinic and found out that he was allergic to eggs. Once I cut eggs out of my diet (as I was breastfeeding), that made a big difference in his ability to settle and stay asleep. The other thing that seemed to help was once he really took to solids.

He still gets thrown off easily (travel, daylight savings, illness), so I think he'll never be the dream sleeper that his big brother has been, but once we got past 6 months, he now sleeps 12 hours straight more nights than not.

I thought it might help others to know that first of all, there is an end in sight and the totally sleepless nights won't last forever. But also, if you feel something is not quite right, to find a GP who is sympathetic and really listens to you, as that made all the difference for us. Once I found her, then it was quite simple to get the allergy testing done. I'd been cutting out dairy and soy with no improvements, only to find out he was allergic to something else!

[shaneleone]

OK - maybe 11 hours most nights.