Are you Sw18sw18? Crypto thread... Post Reply

[GuyD73]

You very kindly posted in response to a thread I started about cryptocurrency and blockchain. 

I'm sorry I didn't respond quickly enough and you seem to have deleted the profile with which you replied. I would be so grateful for the chance to hear your thoughts on different aspects of the market/ecosystem and would be really grateful if you had a moment to drop me a DM with your phone number. 

To those laughing or gloating about the sizeable correction in the markets earlier this month, am I still in profit? Yes thanks. Lost a chunk of my gains but much the wiser for it. I will think of you with sympathy when the charts return to green. 

And as for SW11er.  - How's Brexit going eh??? it's an absolute unmitigated bin fire. Fishing - screwed. Farming - screwed. City - screwed. I feel totally vindicated in EVERY. SINGLE. WORD. I wrote about the nasty, nativist sh*tshow that's Brexit on this site and anywhere else.  

 Is this the same Guy that sells fish? Has really strong views on Brexit and writes really long posts arguing with people who have a different view?

Are you also now regulated to give financial advice. You say it’s not - but just because you say it’s not, doesn’t mean it isn’t.

Be careful.

So for the hard of thinking like him/her - Not financial advice.   

[chorister]

Well, you've obviously had a good night in the pub.  Thank heavens we can all enjoy that again.

Re crypto - may be you could explain how solving complex algorithms generates economic value.

[GuyD73]

Splendid evening thank you yes
Perhaps google it. In the crypto world the acronym is DYOR
You seem to be on here constantly Chorister, I worry you have a rather sad little existence. Get out a bit more perhaps, now we can

[Sw18Sw18]

Hi, hi,

I’m a she - but sorry I like to remain anonymous and sw18 is a little small... in fact you one gave me a fish which was very kind.

What is incredibly sad is the lack of civility in discussion. Cheap personal shots rather than proper debate.

Chorister - I have questions about the dollar and euro too...

How Fiat Money Works

Fiat money only has value because the government maintains that value, or because two parties in a transaction agree on its value. Historically, governments would mint coins out of a valuable physical commodity, such as gold or silver, or print paper money that could be redeemed for a set amount of a physical commodity. Fiat money is inconvertible and cannot be redeemed. The word "fiat" comes from the Latin and is often translated as the decree "it shall be" or "let it be done."

[chorister]

SW18Sw18 - well, if one wants a real debate about it then money actually has two functions.  It is first of all a medium of exchange (ie replacing barter, as more convenient) and then as a representation of wealth; it is NOT wealth of itself.  You are right to be worried if your worry relates to inflation - what has happened is that huge amounts more money have been created without any concomitant increase in wealth, so a unit of money will represent less wealth - that's what inflation is.

There have been interesting examples in the 1970s and than again after 2008.  In the 1970s the oil producers hiked prices, which transferred huge amounts of wealth to them from the West.  But there was no overall increase in wealth, so because it was a zero sum game there was massive inflation in the West.

After 2008 it was different - money was printed, but there was an enormous increase in wealth in China - so globally it was not a zero sum game and inflation remained under control in a globalised economy.

This time I'm not so sure - it's hard to see where the increase in wealth could come from, so inflation looks like a big risk, and actually seems to be starting already.

Crypto doesn't help - it's disconnected from the real world - I repeat the question.  How does solving algorithms create wealth?

And GuyD73 - thank you for the advice.  We are actually off to an expensive country house hotel this afternoon for a few days.  We won't be paying with crypto.

[Sw18Sw18]

People are bartering with currencies minted by solving algorithms. Many but not all have a finite supply so cannot be devalued in the same way as fiats.

I’ve held a little crypto currency for over 10 years, really due to curiosity. Like it or loathe it crypto currencies are being taken seriously by hedge funds and very wealthy investors, I don’t feel foolish for having bought some.

It’s been a profitable experiment. I am now in a position to pay for my children’s private education and all the boring things to build a more secure future for my family like filling investment isas and funding are pensions. Our day to day lives aren’t much different, we don’t go on mega holidays, my husband still works full time but feels less pressure and I have been able to choose a more rewarding job with terrible pay; I tried being a sahm but it wasn’t for me.

I spoke out to sound concern, I didn’t think Guy should be offering crypto advice, after the last month I’m sure he agrees he has much to learn. If he’s having fun, not getting into debt then I don’t really see why you’re upset.

I’m not buying any crypto right now. If there’s another bear market I’ll probably restart a very small monthly regular buy order which I also did after the last big crash but it is a high risk bet.

[chorister]

Well done you for a gamble that came off.  But it's not a currency - it can't be used to buy anything (well almost nothing, not even Teslas anymore) and it certainly isn't a store of value or representation of wealth.  In fact it can only be valued by reference to fiat currencies.  It is inconceivable (and in my opinion also very undesirable) that governments or central banks will ever allow it to compete with fiat currencies.

I'm not upset.  But I do think, as you say, that it is a very high risk bet.  I am reasonably sophisticated about money, and feel some probably misplaced responsibility to try to make sure that others - such as people reading a public website - should be as clear about the risks as you obviously are.  I'm not sure that that is very far from your sound concern.

[Sw18Sw18]

I think it's inconceivable that governments will not mint their own crypto currencies which mirror their fiats. I'm sure these digital currencies will be accepted for goods and will have a role in driving efficiencies in the banking sector and beyond. Without the invention of spam spam spam (admin will delete when they see this!) I'm not sure this would be happening.

bankofengland . co . uk/research/digital-currencies

[chorister]

Oh yes that’s a certainty but it will still be a fiat currency in a different form, under central bank control to issue or not. In concept it’s the same as the difference between coins and notes ie driven by convenience. It’s an interesting debate.

[Annabel (admin)]

I would like to jump in on this thread as I have been contacted by a couple of people from the financial world who are concerned with what they have read on this thread and the original 'crypto' thread.

In the main they would like me to point out that individuals should be very careful about investing on the back of what seems to have been a 'win' for a particular individual.

In addition they would encourage people to take professional advice before investing and reiterate that all investments come with risk and downside.


Sorry ... but I couldn't not share their concerns.



Annabel x
 

[chorister]

Quite right. No need to apologise.

[Sw18Sw18]

Hi Annabelle,

This is very reasonable, please feel free to remove the information about my earnings or indeed just remove the threads.

[GuyD73]

Thanks very much for your reply Sw18sw18, I totally understand your wish for anonymity and congratulations on your success.  Annabel, I completely understand you jumping in. I assumed that crypto being very high risk would be absolutely self-evident but perhaps I could have been clearer about that in my op.  It’s worth noting that I really wasn’t “offering financial advice”. At no point would I ever suggest how, where or to what extent anyone could invest in crypto. I was simply offering to show people in practical terms, how to use automated market makers and where yields can be generated providing liquidity to those markets. Again I clearly didn't articulate this very well. Chorister, please accept my apologies for my tone. I sometimes allow myself to be wound up by people banging on about my position on Brexit and my former seafood business when it has zero relevance to another post, but that’s to my discredit and there’s no excuse for that sort of rudeness. Sorry.

You make some perfectly sensible points about crypto and I agree with some of them. However, I think there are other things happening in the ecosystem that point to increasingly widespread adoption as both store of value and a medium of exchange. I won’t put links here but many of the largest investment banks are starting to offer crypto services to their clients, corporates are putting it on their balance sheets and paypal enabled crypto merchant payments some time ago across millions of businesses who use their platform.  Anyone who’s interested in the broader debate about how money functions, its history and where it’s headed, might be interested to read this book. I by no means agree with all its assertions but it raises some interesting points. https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/364 ... n-standard

[dudette]

I didn’t read the original post and so really don’t have much idea what you’re talking about but it appears you are investing in cryptocurrencies. I’m quite surprised that someone as right on as you would do this. Cryptocurrencies involve using vast quantities of power and so are an environmental disaster.

https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/articles/2021-01-26/is-spam spam spam (admin will delete when they see this!)-mining-worth-the-environmental-cost

[catboo1]

Thanks Chorister, I found your comments helpful in that it answered some questions I had in my head about crypto vs Fiat money. You lay it out in simple terms and I feel you’re right about how the central banks will jump on this themselves at some point, that’s where it might be game over on this ponzi type scheme we are seeing at the moment