When is it acceptable to air your complaints publicly? Post Reply

[Groucho]

Coldatchristmas you say "it goes without saying that if you say person x is ugly or thick then that is wrong." but for many posters they think it is acceptable. Not only do people post this sort of thing on here but other posters defend their right to voicing their opinion.

In answer to your question as to why I think think poor service or a shoddy customer experience should have some form of immunity. I don't. I believe the first port of call should be to the owner, if people truly want to resolve a problem or improve local services this is the most direct way to see some change. If the situation was not resolved then that, in my view, is the time to write on here. However, if people really feel they want to write on here rather than to the business it should not be a meaningless opinion like "it was rubbish service" it should be factual as this gives people the opportunity to make their own decision. It rarely is.

[Groucho]

Lastly I have never been personally affected by posts on the internet but it doesn't take much compassion to understand how devastating personally "opinion" can be when shared forever in print on the internet.

As a parent (many of us are) I think we should lead by example and before spouting off on the web we should go through the right channels. Some (not all) of the posts on here regarding small businesses are at best a tiny snap shot of one persons experience and therefore not particularly relevant to all consumers to possible slanderous cyber bullying.

The thing that astounds me and my initial reason for starting this thread is when someone does write something personal and nasty other posters defend the right of the poster to do so.

[Hattie]

i'm signing off now. Going to go out on this horrid rainy day and smile at people!

[sezwedz]

Well said Groucho!! I find all this negativity and bullying putting me off this site. I doubt Annabel set this site up for this. This is nappy valley, so we are pretty much all mums or dads, lets support each other not shoot each other down.

[Bluebutterfly]

Well said Sedwedz, over the past couple of weeks I have been really surprised by the number of posts that have felt like personal attacks on the OP. Often even with posts in defence of the OP or the person/business concerned, the tone of the response is incredibly aggressive. Of course people have strong views on certain matters, and I'm not suggesting that everything should be sugar-coated, it's more about putting your point across without it making others feel slammed down. I feel that we live in a lovely friendly community, when I'm out and about, but reading the posts on here you would think that many people are being treated for severe anger-management issues and this is an outlet!! I'm not highlighting this particular topic as one of them by the way, it just seemed a good place to put this across. As has been said previously, part of the problem is the way the written word comes across in different ways to different people, but there are ways of saying "I consider this to be totally inappropriate" without resorting to insults....

So I guess this is a plea for people to be a bit more polite and sensitive in their responses whenever possible... I live in hope!!! I know that people (myself included) are often reluctant to join in to a debate as they feel that they will be lynched online, which is a shame...

[Hattie]

High five to that Twinsmummy!

[supergirl]

I believe strongly in everyone's right to an opinion.
I equally strongly believe to everyone's right to a second chance and to respond. I also believe that since we are all only humans and therefore imperfect, we should cur each other some slacks. As someone said earlier, we are all allowed an off day.
In the case of independant businesses, it takes years to build an image and a reputation. But it would take a tenth of that time to destroy it with a negative story. Of course it is the responsability of the owner/manager to keep the standards high but as someone said you cant be behind your staff 24/7. Some staff are on a learning curve as well.

In my opinion, always talk or write to the owner/manager first, and if the response is not good enough maybe a next step should be considered. Times are extremely hard for businesses ATM not only because of the low level of trading snd competition but also because of the pensions some have to start giving their employees from 2014. As i said in another thread, for most owners they dont have more than a year (if they have that much) of working capital in the bank...

I had 2 recents very bad customer service very very locally, and all sorted now.

Anyway it is only my opinion (disclaimer: i dont have a business). Sw

[Camille]

This has been a great post and some of the rational, decent, contributions have begun to restore my faith in NVN which seemed recently to have become a bit of a "slagging off" fest for anyone with even the slighest grievance.

[clapset]

I have owned family businesses in small areas and know how demanding people can be. SW11 has more than it's share of extremely demanding people, let's not forget that. When running a business we always tried to train staff to give the best experience and deliver quality and professionalism. But the fact is you can't deliver every service yourself, you sometimes can't get staff that are in your mirror image, and you have to trust what you have built with other people, who you often can't afford to pay handsomely. Add to that trying to have your own family and you have no idea how stressful operating a public facing "shop" can be and the hours that go into keeping it going. It's 24 hours a day because when people stop coming you certainly don't sleep - everybody has to be paid at the end of the month - and sometimes that means you don't. You may sometimes want to sack the staff for not delivering but then you'd have no staff.

So when you have a service that isn't up to standard - you have a right to complain. You have a right to do that in a decent on honest manner with respect. You have the right to be treated with respect. Only when all of that falls down and the owner treats you like you are worthless should you press the kill button before that - think about what the implications may be. And if you want to do that before the owner has had a right to protect his/her reputation - use your name so the owner can resolve it with you.

[Medway]

I completely agree with all of this. Thanks for this post - it has made me think about things differently...I have not posted a complaint but I have read other people's and I agree subconciously you probably retain some of that negativity and if passing that cafe/ restaurant/ shop decide to walk on to the next one 'because I've heard they are rude in here.' I think my next point will be controversial but here goes 1) Many many people who live in Nappy Valley are well off and as a result have a great standard of living 2) They are well off becuase they have/ or had good, well paid professional jobs which kept them very busy and intellectually stimulated. 3) when these intellectually stimulating jobs and exchanged for the different job of raising children (just as difficult and hardwork but in other ways), they get a bit bored and frustrated. 4) A less than ideal service/ rude shopkeeper/ ugly waitress = something to get worked up about and maybe have a rant on the internet. TBH - and I include myself in this - alot of this is due to too much free time and not enough stimulation. Victor Meldrew was in the same position.

[clapset]

NVN is a great area, has some great shops; great people; and is made expensive. There are some crazy shop owners; some interesting shop owners and some lovely shop owners. They all add to the flavour. To put into perspective running a business with 10 staff can cost £15k a month in salary & taxes; £5k+ a month on rent; £15k a quarter in VAT payments; then add heating, water, gas, etc ... before you've even thought about stock and shop fitting (minimum £50-100k). When you're spending £25 - £50 on a service / product and get the hump you deserve great service but at the expense of who / what? If it's Starbucks they will survive - in fact they won't care because they make their tax loss and keep smiling. Look at SW11 shop fronts and who has disappeared in the last 18 months. Independent traders unfortunately. Get what you deserve but do it the right way.

Don't get me wrong I'm the worst at complaining but I do at the time in front of the person responsible and I get an outcome and move on. I have posted on here before about big corporates / local govt before but never independents.

What makes me laugh is the "what we want on ncote road" chain ... lots of people doe eyedly talking about what they would like but no-one with the bottle to invest - because you invariable put everything you have on the line. If the business is poor quality eventually it will be found out!

[supergirl]

I absolutely agree, no need to complain publicly because a poor level of customer service in any business will eventually be found out!

Medway - i agree with what you say but i am not sure it happens because of too much free time and too little stimulation. Certainly this might be one of the contributing factor. But i wonder whether our generation feel very entitled as well... I mean "worked hard, study hard, want it all so i deserve" in a way?

Fuel for thoughts

[Groucho]

I debated whether to write the original post but I am glad I did as it seems it's not only me that feels this way.


Supergirl - I agree with what you have just written here but I wondered if I could ask a question in a friendly and non confrontational fashion?
I seem to remember you were one of the posters supporting the rights that it's ok to write anything on here because it's an opinion. This is in regard to the poster who said "the staff were thick.....". I just wondered whether you still support the argument now? I am not trying to criticise just trying to understand where you stand on the issue. It may not have been you and I apologise if I have misremembered.

Medway and Clapset - I actually think it is very British not to complain in an honest and open fashion. Americans have always been more upfront and say it as it is but we Brits tend to say nothing at the time and then gossip like crazy, telling everyone we can how crap someone/something is. I think it's cultural but with the arrival of the internet and it's anonymous nature I fear the moaning/bitching will cause untold damage for all customer facing employees and businesses.

[supergirl]

Groucho - of course you can ask
In regards to your question and the thread you are referring to, i was actually saying the same as here. I really believe everyone as the right of an opinion and i was just voicing concerns in regards to deleting a post simply because the opinion was not acceptable by others. I can see where the confusion arised because i didnt specify that i was not in any way supporting the insults. I think insulting people privately or publicly is unacceptable and despicable. In my defense i had no idea (and still dont have any) of what "short as two planks" could mean or refers to as english is not my first language.
I hope this clarify my view a little bit. Let me know if not.

And thanks for starting that thread. Good one. Sx

[Groucho]

Thank you Super girl that does make sense.